Chamber's Virginia Lock

[Black Jaque Janaviac]

I have an Early Virginia longrifle with a Chamber's Virginia lock on it.  Due to the D-weight barrel and the builder's unfamiliarity with this particular lock, the builder . . . well . . . goofed.

The forward lock bolt is too close to the mainspring.  In fact the mainspring is in the way.  In fact the corner of the mainspring had to be filed down in order for the bolt to clear. 

I've had this gun for years and have not had the mainspring break.  It wasn't until I broke the mainspring using a vise-grip to clamp it that I even discovered the problem.  When I ordered a new mainspring I found I had to file the "nose", apex, or whatever you call it down.  This second mainspring is serving a number of years with good reliability.  (I have since purchased a proper mainspring vise along with the replacement spring).

Anyway, it wasn't until much later that I got to thinking, maybe the filed-down mainspring is the reason for the lock's slow timing.  Like I said the lock is wonderfully reliable.  But it is slow.  And the slowness isn't from the touch-hole being too low. It's a delay from tripping the trigger to the flash of the pan.  I've had another lock that were instantaneous - the time from trigger-trip to panflash was imperceptable to me.  This one, well, I can feel the lock vibrations in the stock before things go off.  Other people watching me notice the slowness.

For a long time I thought this was part-n-parcel to the hugeness of the lock.  My fast lock was a small Pedersoli.  So I just figured the timing was the difference between locks.

Then I thought maybe the guys at ALR have experience with the Chamber's Virginia Lock.  Is this a fast lock in your guys' estimation?

If this is due to the weakened mainspring do you guys have any suggestions to correct it?  I'm thinking of filing down the frizzen spring to balance the two out.  Perhaps if the mainspring doesn't have to work so hard to push the frizzen out of the way. . .

[Acer Saccharum]

Big locks tend to be slower than the smaller locks, just because the parts are bigger, have more inertia, etc. But they develop tremendous sparks, which helps reliabilty on a damp day. 

Man, I don't like messing with springs. Can you re-locate your threaded hole?

[G-Man]

Maybe start by trying a new mainspring, and leave the front lockbolt out while testing it? If it works faster, then you could consider relocating the forward bolt or (easier) if your inletting is good and your rear lock bolt draws everything up snug and secure, you could just make a dummy for the forward bolt.

Guy

[Jim Kibler]

Like others have mentioned, the best solution is to move the front lock bolt forward.  The original lock hole can be welded shut, the hole in the stock can be plugged and a new sideplate will likely have to be made.   The front bolt hole can then be redrilled and put where it should be.

[Dennis Glazener]

Like Acer said, these old big locks have more to move and I suspect that is what is causing the seemingly slower lock time. I just tested my fowler that has the same lock. It seemed to take forever for the pan to go off. I am used to using the late ketland locks and hadn't fired one of old locks in several years. I bet if you tried a new spring like Guy suggested you will not notice an difference. I you do think the new lock is faster You might be able to find someone that sells a hand forged spring that will fit in the lock without having to alter it. The hand forged springs that I have seen are not as large as the cast springs used today.
Dennis

[The other DWS]

Of course the most obvious thing is to contact Jim Chambers 1st and see what he advises. He's nothing but most helpful.

weld up and redrill or replace the lockplate, plug and redrill the bolthole in the stock  or would you have to replace the sideplate too?


wondering,  is it the arc-distance the hammer travels that makes it feel slow, or is it the weight of the hammer.  seems to me that most of the spring's force is in the lower limb.  I wonder how much the hairpin bend really effects the speed of throw.

[Roger Fisher]

Suggest use the rear bolt only and a phoney frt. Only you will know...much less messing around  She'll work just as well good or bad.

[Mark Elliott]

I have used those locks and they work just fine for me, but they do have an unusually long throw.  The first thing that I would check is the operation of the lock out of the gun with an unmodified spring.   If there is a difference in performance, then my guess is that the lock is binding somewhere.   I wouldn't at all be surprised if  the mainspring is binding, particularly when you crank down on the front screw.   

As to filing a notch in the spring, you should not do that.    You don't even want scratches across the spring, not less file a notch in the highest stress point of the spring; the bend.   You can file down the spring elsewhere, but avoid reducing the spring at the bend.   You will significantly weaken the spring.  In all cases, the spring should be re-polished where you file it.

Like others have said, it would be better to reposition the front screw.     

Also,  make sure that the lock cycles smoothly without the mainspring installed.   If it drags or catches, that needs to be addressed, most likely with a stone. 

[Black Jaque Janaviac]

Lots of good suggestions.  thanks.

Moving the front bolt seems like it would be difficult. 

It seems like the lock goes Ker-Klatch! instead of just Klatch!

That's what caused me to think it might have been an imbalance between the two springs.   Thought maybe it was doing too much work getting the frizzen out of the way. 

[rich pierce]

Moving the front bolt is not hard if you fake it and don't use a front bolt.  I guess then it's re-moving the front bolt, LOL.  You can inlet a little nut (not me) in the wood under the sideplate to take a shortened lock bolt.

[Black Jaque Janaviac]

Well, I took a little bit off the frizzen spring and it seems a little quicker.  I don't feel that double shock (ker-klatch) in the stock. 

It's $17 for either a mainspring or a frizzen spring.  So I figured I'd work the frizzen spring down.  There's a chance that it will work and will last a long time in which case I don't have to spend any more than whatever the smal scraps of emory cloth I consumed. 

If it's true that the bend in the spring doesn't contribute much to the strength other than keeping the two leafs united, then the bolt placement really isn't the problem at all.  Since the lock has lasted faithfully for years.  The first spring I broke was due to improper handling with a visegrip.

[rich pierce]

I'd keep an extra mainspring on hand.

[Frank]

I'd keep an extra mainspring on hand.

Good advice. I keep an extra mainspring on hand for all my locks.

[Roger Fisher]

I'd keep an extra mainspring on hand.

Yes, and keep one in the shootin box that you are dragging around for the particular rifle/gun you are shooting that day.   i.e. Quite a few years ago at a shoot in Chester County the M Spring in my siler snapped.  I replaced it on the spot and missed 1 (one) relay only.  Oh yes, also keep a spring clamp in said shootin box...

My apologies for veering somewhat from the subject.......

[smylee grouch]

If you go with a fake front lock bolt, you might want to check to make sure that the pan still snugs up against side flat so priming wont trickle down into lock mortice. I have same lock in a hunting rifle that had front bolt graze top of ramrod hole so put fake bolt in and used pan greese (1/4 bees wax &3/4 tallow melted together,peanut butter consistency) between lock and barrel. Used same stuf allaround pan and water proofed the whole works.   This works but moving front bolt is best route which i will eventuly do.  Good luck which ever way you do it.   Gary