Author Topic: Double barrel 10g muzzle loader  (Read 6724 times)

Muzzlesmoke

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Double barrel 10g muzzle loader
« on: May 28, 2010, 08:58:33 AM »
I hope someone can help me.  I need to know about this shotgun.  Who made it.  On the barrel rib it says.
London fine twist and on the lock Richards.  I know there was a gunsmith  W. Richards.  With my research on this gun.  I believe it is a knock- off, made by a Belgian company.  They couldn't use Richards full name.  Under the barrel there is only two letters.  WR
If anybody owns one or knows anything about.  Let me know.........also the value.

I'll try to post pictures.  It is about 80%, they have been shooting it.......so it works.  It has German silver instead of brass.  I is nicely engraved and has a patch bow.

Thanks for any help,

Muzzlesmoke

Offline nord

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Re: Double barrel 10g muzzle loader
« Reply #1 on: May 28, 2010, 03:06:51 PM »
Proofs should be found on the bottom side of the tubes now hidden by the forestock. Neither Brit nor Belgian would surprise me. Those tubes were made in Europe and were proved there. By law they must have been so stamped.

A true Westley Richards will always be marked as such. Birmingham as I remember had several legitimate makers by the name of Richards. Never just an initial nor a single name for a Westley Richards. None approached Westley Richards for quality.

"London Fine Twist" is a further indication of a trade gun. Twist is one of the least expensive types of damasc construction. Basically a ribbon of iron and a ribbon of steel twisted together and welded to form the tube. If an English gun it was almost certainly not produced for domestic use as makers seldom if ever stamped their product in such a manner. Trade items, though, often carried this stamping.

If a Belgian gun, then almost anything goes. Let's just say the Belgians had a way with words... Anything to make a gun seem attractive to a potential buyer. They'd commonly use "London Fine Twist" to confuse the issue at hand.

The fact that the gun is still in use doesn't really surprise me. Damascus tubes don't usually fail quite the way we sometimes think. They usually bulge slightly, then begin to "unravel" for the lack of a better term. USUALLY. If the tubes have been well cared for and loads have been kept moderate using only black powder, then I'd expect them to still be sound.

For myself I'll stick to my L.C. Smith doubles with fluid steel tubes. Laminated tubes are from another era and technology. But, again, it's just my opinion and others feel differently.

Value? We don't do that here. I'd suggest a trip to <Antiqueguns.com> for that answer.
« Last Edit: May 28, 2010, 03:10:22 PM by nord »
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Muzzlesmoke

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Re: Double barrel 10g muzzle loader
« Reply #2 on: May 28, 2010, 07:03:15 PM »
nord,

Thanks for the help.   I did not know there was more gun makers named Richards.  I pretty sure it was made in Belgian.  I'll check out other sources about this shotgun.  But, the gun was made in the early
1800's.  It is in good shape, and is shooter.  I think I will buy it.............

Muzzlesmoke

I'll also check out antiques.com

Offline Mike Brooks

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Re: Double barrel 10g muzzle loader
« Reply #3 on: May 28, 2010, 07:08:50 PM »
Quote
  But, the gun was made in the early
1800's.
Not likely if it's a percussion gun.
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Offline nord

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Re: Double barrel 10g muzzle loader
« Reply #4 on: May 28, 2010, 08:13:47 PM »
As per Mike...

Not early 1800's!  More like 1860 and more likely a decade or so later.
In Memory of Lt. Catherine Hauptman Miller 6/1/21 - 10/1/00 & Capt. Raymond A. Miller 12/26/13 - 5/15/03...  They served proudly.

Offline 490roundball

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Re: Double barrel 10g muzzle loader
« Reply #5 on: May 28, 2010, 08:57:32 PM »
and Westley Richards may have been the most commonly counterfeited makers name on low end guns.
"It's a poor word that can't be spelt two ways" Tom Yeardley in Swanson's Silent Drum