first ball and patch selection

[brokenflint]

I know this has been hashed out before so if anyone has links poiont me in the right direction.  I'm looking for how ya all start from scratch and work out a ball and patch combination for a new rifle or pistol.  As an example lets take the .58 cal (rifled not smooth in this case) for a starting place.  Do ya all purchase various round sized balls and try different patch thickness until you hit a keeper and then purchase a mould?  Give me your thoughts on this please.

Broke

[BrownBear]

That's about it.  I'm more inclined to buy "standard" size balls first and experiment with patch thickness until I find a combo that works best.  Then if I feel the perfect patch is too thick or thin, I'll try a larger or small ball that lets me use a patch I like better.   I've got some "useless" molds around that I bought before knowing a rifle well, and then something else worked out better.  Kinda wasteful, so the most recent gun came with two ball sizes.  After shooting and experimenting I'll know which mold to buy the first time around.

[northmn]

Depends on caliber and how common it is.  When I selected ball for my 25 I checked to see if a 1/4 brass rod would go down the bore.  It did so I used #3 buck.  Most barrels use a fairly common sized ball such taht it is the patching that may vary.  For instance I am willing to bet a 445 ball will be loadable in almost any 45 made by Green Mountain or Coleraine.  Some 50's may be a bit tight but a 495 generally works for targets, 535 in a 54.  TOW sells rbs and its not a bad idea to buy a couple of sizes and try them before getting a mold.  Actually, unless you shoot a lot, it may be more econ9omical
just to buy the ball.

DP

[bgf]

You probably already know this, but don't even bother testing for accuracy at 25 yards, except getting the sights roughly set up; test the loads at 50.  A lot of combinations will shoot very well at 25, but fail at 50, sometimes pretty miserably.  A ball 0.005" under is your best bet, but 0.010" is usually what is recommended to start with; I would get some of each, just for testing.  Swaged vs. handcast has made little difference in my testing.  Also get several patch selections -- the thickest one that you can load without getting ridiculous will probably be the best.  0.018" pillow ticking is pretty standard, so get something on either side of that (thinner and thicker).  If you change anything, you need to re-test.  I.e., the same patch and ball will almost certainly perform differently with oil versus spit, and you might have to adjust the powder charge.  By the way, each patch and ball  (not to mention lube) combo needs to be tested with different powder charges as well, at least until you get a feel for what will work, and even then you can be surprised.

In my case, I also have a special plinking combo which is easy to load and does fine to about 30 yards, but I wouldn't use it for hunting, unless maybe as a quick reload.  That is fun to work up, using leftovers from load testing.

Finally, I have to state that I am not that experienced, so take that into account.  I just remember the details to some degree because I went through it for myself last year .

[Daryl]

With normal rifle, what DP and bgf say works well. With vary narrow grooves and wide lands (opposite of ideal) you might have to start with a ball .010"under the bore diameter.

So- the first thing to do is look at the rifling type. If equal or wider grooves than lands, .005" is right - that's easy. Next is to measure the bore diameter to the nearest thousandth of an inch. Subtract .005" and that's the ball size. Most normal barrels from regular suppliers can be trusted for size, ie: their .50 needs a .495" ball, a .45, a .445" ball, that sort of thing.

Next is patch material - denim works for us all - but some might prefer linen or ticking.  I just can't see paying over $20.00 per meter for linen, besides the stores don't carry it in thick enough bolts.  The .005"/under ball needs a .020" to .022" thick patch. 10 or 12 ounce denim works for us - all of us.  Thus finding a load is no more technical than changing powder charges while shooting at  50 yards, minimum for 'testing' loads.  I prefer to zero the sights at 25 after finding a load, then I know it is virtually zeroed at 50 & 4" low at 100yards - roughly, within fractions of an inch. I zero at 25 as accuracy of holding is more easily accomplished and the results come in quickly. No wind or other distractions to muddy the sight picture.  Then, check the zero at 50 yards and further.

That is a standard recipe that has worked in every barrel from 1973 until present- no exceptions. The only thing to do is to make sure the crown is nicely smoothed and try different powder charges and slightly different patch thickness. Forget about .010" to .015" patching - it isn't even any good for cleaning - 1 exception - if you are shooting a ball larger than the bore, .015" might be the best for your gun.

I have found that a ball .005" under, along with 10oz. denim works in all guns for target-type loads, but some prefer thicker patching for heavy hunting loads, especially in smaller bores, like .45 or .50 with higher pressures than the larger bores.

One other thing, if a .020" to .022" patch is difficult to load, something is wrong.  The crown is too sharp or not enough lube.

[brokenflint]

Thanks Guys  as soon as I finish up the latest one, I'll give what ya all pointed out a try.  Don't really want to waste scarce cash on moulds 

Broke