Ballistol Water Patch Lube mix

[Muleskinner]

Whats a good mix of the two for shooting patch lube? I am talking shooting it without cleaning between shots I use Lehigh right now but am running out of it

[Daryl]

For range shooting, most of us use a Winter Winshield Washer Fluid with a bit of oil mixed in - say 4oz. oil in a gallon. The addition of a bit of liquid soap will help emulsify the oil, but that really isn't necessary, as you shake the container, then pour over the patches in their box, soak up the liquid, drain the excess back into the container.

I mix up a gallon, then shake well, and pour it into a small bottle  (10oz. that fits in my shooting box.  This lasts many weeks of shooting 1 day a week.  Total cost is around $4.00 - the oil can be some of the olive oil your wife buys.

I've never used balistol- spit or WWF olive oil or neetsfootoil shoots splendidly in my guns - all of them.

[hanshi]

Daryl, there are a number of WW fluid of different compositions.  Which one do you use and what are the choices to look for?

[T*O*F]

there are a number of WW fluid of different compositions

You guys talk about this as though it were some type of magic concoction.  Regular washer solvent is nothing but water, alcohol, and blue dye.  The freezing point is adjusted by adding more or less alcohol.  You can make your own and check the concentration (specific gracity) with an antifreeze checker, either a hydrometer or an optical refractor.  Summer solvent freezes at 20 degrees.  Winter concentrations vary from 0 to -20, and perhaps colder in northern Canada and Alaska.

The dye serves no purpose other than identification.  Not that it will ever happen in a gun, but did you ever look at the WW solvent container in an old car and notice the blue, crusty corrosion around it.

[Daryl]

We use normal, non-fancy/nothing speical,  -35 to -45 fluid.  

[Daryl]

Good point about the composition, TOF - we use it because it's handy, and easy to obtain & 1/3rd the cost of a gallon of alcohol by itself.
 A gallon of washer fluid will last several years if used for lubing patches only.  We never have to worry about a non-freezing lube when using it.
Note I also said spit - shoots just as well - in every gun I own.   Lehighvalley lube seemed to shoot better in my .40, however I've shot just as many 1/2" groups now with spit and/or  the washer fluid mix. as with Lehighvalley lube.
I have a quart of Toll Oil but still need the rest of the stuff to make my own LHValley lube. Just haven't gotten around to mkixing it up yet.
  

[Leatherbelly]

Tof,you forgot  a little methyl hydrate. Yep, I mix in some Dr. Bronner's"Magic" castile  peppermint vegetable soap,equal amount of neetsfoot oil. I've using the winter variety of W washer. No wiping needed.Cleans up good,shoots good,so I'm happy.

[Leatherbelly]

Daryls,
 what else do you need? Sodium Hydroxide? If so, lemme know Sunday. I think I can pinch some from the lab. We get it by the tank car load.

[Muleskinner]

Thanks for the info guys....never tried the WW fluid......could one just mix alcohol and water? I got lots of 91% alcohol around

[doulos]

As far as a ballistol patch lube I use it diluted any where from about 5-1 to 7-1 and havent seen any difference in accuracy.

[Daryl]

Muleskinner- sure- if you've already got the alky, go ahead.  The oil helps reduce the evapouration rate, I think.  Patches stay lubed in a not-so-tight patch box for over a week - usually.  By wet, if you squeezed them hard enough, you'd get drips.
Methyl Hydrate is what I burn in my airplane engines that I mix fuel for.  As far as I know, it's simply methyl alcohol (gas line antifreeze) - the cheapest of alcohols to purchase - at $10.00 a gallon locally, + the govertnment hazard fee.

[Dphariss]

Daryls,
 what else do you need? Sodium Hydroxide? If so, lemme know Sunday. I think I can pinch some from the lab. We get it by the tank car load.

As I am sure you know one must be careful what is mixed with lye. Various undesirable fumes and gases can result.

Lye is not something I would add to a bore cleaner.
Some soaps are already plenty corrosive.
I used to recommend household window cleaner cut with 2 parts water as a cleaning solvent but I have been having rusting problems with them. Some of the "green" formula are REALLY nasty when they hit BP fouling brown in seconds. So after years of success in the last year I have given up on them and will have to find something else, maybe WWF. Since using tallow as a patch lube seems to require some wetting agent.

Dan

[Daryl]

Sodioum Hydroxide (lye) is needed to blaance the PH of the Tall Oil, which is either corroisve, or acidic- acidic, I think. Once the PH is about 72, it's neutral.  Sounds awful and strange to mix up to potentially dangerous substances to arrive at a superior lube, but that's how it goes - I guess.
For normal target work, we'll be sticking the second cheapest lube and the only one that works perfectly in the winter time here - WWFluid and a bit of oil. some guys adda tich of soap, such as Murphy's saddle soap, but so far, I havent' found that to be necessay- might try it just to see if there's a difference.

What we do see with the WWFluid and oil, is easier or quicker cleaning than when straight spit is used.  At Taylor has said numberous times, the bucket of water (about 2 quarts - I use a 2 1/2 pound coffee can) barely turns a bit greyish. That's the fouling buildup from the breech area and from cleaning the lock in the same bucket.  There is very little fouling left in the bore itself. Note our normal ball/patch combos are used which clean the last shot as you load the next one.

[cahil_2]

why mess with all the mixing of stuff, just buy some Shenandoah Valley which replaced LeHigh Valley.  The stuff works great and you never have to clean between shots.

[William Worth]

why mess with all the mixing of stuff, just buy some Shenandoah Valley which replaced LeHigh Valley.  The stuff works great and you never have to clean between shots.

But where's the fun in that?  It's all about the mixing and making, the baking and shaking.   

[Daryl]

why mess with all the mixing of stuff, just buy some Shenandoah Valley which replaced LeHigh Valley.  The stuff works great and you never have to clean between shots.

A while back (2years or so ago), when I heard about the Shenendoah Valley Lube, I asked if anyone would test it (not available here at that time) - no one answered the thread. Another one was the Hornady BP solvent in the same bottle as the Shenendoah stuff.
It's nice to hear you've used it - I saw it for sale at BC Rendezvous 2010 for around $10.00 a bottle.  if it works well, that's about what LHV cost landed here with shipping from Track.  If I can mix up virtually exactly the same thing with free materials from the Pulp Mill, I'll go that rounte.

As far as wiping - we don't do that anyway - doesn't matter if we shoot 20 shots, or 90.  We get no fouling buildup using spit, or the WWWFluid&Oil during range shooting, trail walks or with mink oil for hunting.

[beleg2]

Hi,
I have used Daryl's lube BeeWax+vaseline.
Have anyone use straight liquid vaseline as patch lube?
Thanks
Martin

[mainiac]

Daryl,,could you tell me the recipe for the lvl? This tall oil,,what is it??Whats the other ingredients?I use alot of shenandoah lube,cause my lehigh is about gone.

BTW, I work at a pulp-paper mill

[Daryl]

I don't have the formula handy right here, but it's Tall oil, caustic, ie: lye, pine oil and alcohol I believe.  The manner in which it is mixed can be dangerous - boil-overs. You'll need a method of testing to mix it to a PH level of 72, for a neutral lube.
Tall oil is a by-product of the pulp and paper industry - and is sold the world over by distributors.  Just google it, amazing. I assume it is acidic- whereas the combination with caustic lye neutralizes it.  Sounds a bit scary to put in your barrel. Sometimes what stuff is made of is pretty strange.

[Harnic]

Daryl, I think I'll stay with Hoppes #9+ rather than play with anymore of the "Northern Witches brews" from you guys!  The last time I tried one it took months to get all the Murphys residue out! 

[mainiac]

I went reading,,,,,,,,,,,,it is confusing!!! I did read where tall oil is derived from pine pulping.That frigs up my source,because my mill uses spruce/fir sawdust for there softwood fiber,no pine allowed.

[Daryl]

Daryl, I think I'll stay with Hoppes #9+ rather than play with anymore of the "Northern Witches brews" from you guys!  The last time I tried one it took months to get all the Murphys residue out! 

Taylor and some of the other boys are using Murphys in their WWWfluid mix. None of them is getting any residue from the Murphys - guess their combinations could be a mite tighter than yours is.  I can understand if there is blowby, it might burn some goop onto the bore. For them, they find cleaning to be faster and esier than when using WWWFluid and straight oil or with spit or any other concoction they've used.  Yesterday, and ust for the test's sake, I tasted the cleaning water after cleaning both my lock and rifle barrel from the Sunday shooting - yesterday. It was barely discoloured at all, but then, I only fired around 50 shots (.40 cal.) using 55gr. 2f for powder. The water only tasted slightly sulferish.  Mixed with strong rum, you or I might not even notice it.

[Harnic]

When I start shooting again in the spring I'll try a tighter patch Daryl, but I'm happy with the Hoppes lube & I have lots of it.  My patches get a bit more browned than I'd like to see with the denim (0.018"), so I'll try the cotton duck (0.023") I bought a few years back.