Leather Patches

[Paddlefoot]

I was talking with Mr. Rice the other day about a barrel I was buying and the subject of which is more accurate square or round bottom rifling came up. His opinion was that they can be equally accurate but it is probably easier to find a proper ball-patch fit on the square bottom grooves. Got me thinking about it a bit and I recalled that as a young kid I had a book about Davey Crockett that showed him loading his rifle with balls patched in light leather. Anyone have any evidence that this was actually done or has antone actually tried it? I was thinking it might make some sense for those deep round bottomed grooves.

[David R. Pennington]

Have never tried it but a friend of mine (he is in his 70s) says his great grandmother said when she was young the boys would use squirrel hides for their patching because the cloth was too valuable. Even the scraps were re used for quilts, rugs, etc...

[Paddlefoot]

I could see thin leather being good to seal the deep rifling grooves and of course there would always be some rawhide or buckskin around if you were hunting to feed yourself.

[Daryl]

Taylor tried buckskin in his .62 with a ball from a homemade mould, some 35 years ago.  He's used cloth & commercial moulds ever since. That should say something.  It will work, but not as well as cloth in most of today's barrels.  Buckskin or other skins are not of a consistant thickness and this makes things worse, accuracy wise.  The 'grip' or snuggness changes shot to shot and as all know consistency is accuracy.

The Rice round bottom .016" deep grooves, as do Getz barrel's rounded grooves do well with a ball .005" under and a .020" to .022" patch - as does everyone's square bottomed grooves - same ball, same patch. Sort of a cure-all-load for all normal barrels. If the rifling is deper yet, you will probably have to try something else liek a smaller ball and thicker patch - that might be where fawn skin or thcker will work better -

[Paddlefoot]

Ok , Thanks Daryl, I figured that would be how it is but was curious about it. I suppose a split leather like a chamouis might work OK if you had to try it.

[Daryl]

Other than just for the knowledge, I'd not shoot up a chamois.  I suspect the leather would not hold lube like a cloth patch and that fouling might be a problem- just a thought.

[FRJ]

What  was used by the early colonists and then the mountain men? Frank

[Matt Szychulda]

Chamois work great and hold the lube fine.  I use a bit of bear grease on the patch, and find they load very easily.  I can seat a ball with one stroke.  Accuracy is very good.  My friend has been using them for years and swears by them.  They do not work in my fowler though, they don't compress enough with the lack of rifling groves to fill.

[Daryl]

Matt - how many shots can be loaded and fired before you have to wipe the bore?

[axelp]

I have used thin greased leather in hunting situations. I would suspect that the number of shots you get does not matter all that much in a hunting situation. But I have used leather for some target shooting and found little difference between my cloth patch and the leather... it holds grease well, and fouling is not any different.... There seems to be more difference due to weather than patch material.

K

[Daryl]

That's an interesting observation, Ken.  I have not found any difference in loading using cloth patches with any weather extremes - except for severe cold - ie: minus 30 and colder.

Seems to me Taylor's first .62 Hawken got crunchy after a few shots using leather for patches - course, who knows what lube he was using- probably crisco shortening smeared all over. That means his bore's condition was changing shot to shot - not a recipe for accuracy, but for hunting larger game with large X rings, I suspose it's OK.

Today, I really don't see a need to use leather, with it being the most expensive and least accurate method of loading.

[axelp]

Clarification: When its dry/less humid, I seem to have more fouling "trouble" than when the air is humid. Maybe the fouling is actually the same, but the moister air makes it easier to push around with my ramrod?

Another reason that I kind of like using greased leather is that in my woods it can be awful dry--- and greased leather is less of a fire hazard.

K

[hammer]

I recall some English duelling/target pistol cased sets had patches of fine kid leather.    And they weren't unusual for fine hunting rifles.   I don't recall ever seeing any lube containers with these or that the patches were already lubed.  But then a dry patch will load with no problem in a clean bore. 

[axelp]

when its slathered with lube, a leather patch loads really slick---you can feel it conform to the bore. I bet even spit would cause a chamois patch to load pretty easy.