Need some Christian Hawken info

[galamb]

I'm doing all my homework for a planned Christian Hawken build. I must say this guy is driving me a little nuts. There is pretty limited information on him out there (his son's "hog" all the published history).

I have 7 original examples to study. They range in caliber from 44 to 50 (that's fine). While I have the barrel lengths for all I only know that two were tapered barrels - 1" to 7/8" straight taper.

No two locks are the same so suspect he bought from whatever source was available. Likewise the triggers were all different but the DST's do look like later "hawken" triggers. On 4 of the 7 rifles he used barrel keys, the other 3 he used pins, and often used two pins to hold ramrod pipes (but not always and sometimes only used 2 pins on the entry pipe).

Some stocks were carved and sometimes plain and some tangs were flared "slightly", others were straight.

(this actually helps because it allows me a certain amount of freedom in choices and it's still representative)

So my question is: is anyone aware if he used swamped barrels? I'm just a hobby builder and buy my "stuff" off the shelf for the most part.

It's easy enough to get a 42" swamped barrel or straight barrel from numerous suppliers (without having to wait many months) but a 42" tapered barrel in sub 50 cal tapered 1" to 7/8" is something you have to wait for (plus I'm in Canada which just elevates the issues and delays significantly).

If I can not get confirmation and/or specs of a C Hawken with a swamped barrel I am going to opt for a 13/16" or 7/8", 40 or 45 cal (probably Colerain) and call it good.

Thanks in advance if you can help me out here...

[JTR]

For the time period that C Hawken was working, a swamped barrel would have been the norm. A tapered barrel would have been unusual. Possibly the tapered barrels you measured were originally swamped, and have had the muzzles cut back (which was common) and have lost the swamp?

John

[galamb]

Possible, but both were right in around 42" which was typical for his rifles built in the first decade of the 1800's.

I do have some limited specs on a earlier rifle with a 48" barrel, but nothing on the dimensions beyond length which could have been swamped, and yes, cut back would appear as a straight taper.

I too assume that a swamp would be correct I just can't find any first hand info of an actual rifle with a swamped barrel..

[B Shipman]

Christian Hawkens work varies greatly. His stock style varies. His carving style is generally very low relief or incised but that can be outstanding or routine. A swamped barrel, if not extreme or slightly  tapered would be fine. Completely different from an Armstrong or a J.P.Beck who once their style
 was established, kept it for the majority of their carries.

[galamb]

Thanks Bill,

that's the kind of conclusions I was starting to come to myself. I have pictures of three earlier rifles (pre-1800) and they had barrels with lengths of 48-51 1/2 inches. After 1800 he seems to have settled in the 42'ish inch length, but could only find full specs on two and both were 15/16" to 7/8" tapered (with one note that eluded to a 15/16" "straight" barrel).

Also, no two locks or triggers are the same on the nine examples I found and as you note, he had some very plain stocks and the ones that are carved are not in "the same class" as say Armstrong (I hope that doesn't sound overly critical).

Before getting your response I pretty much had got down to a coin toss on the barrel selection. Figured on either a "Southern Classic" A weight in 45 cal from Rice - would give me the 15/16" breech (which I have documentation on) and is not severely swamped coming out at 13/16" at the muzzle (think it would work quite nice) weighing about 4 1/2 pounds in 45 cal, or to keep it light with a straight barrel and go with a 13/16" straight in 45 cal (maybe 40) at 4 1/2 to 5 pounds.

While I have no examples that either would have been correct (especially the 13/16" straight) I figured with the lack of information out there at least the critics wouldn't have much to point out

I kinda get the impression that Christian "scrounged" parts (locks, triggers, barrels) from wherever he could (that's what the examples seem like).

Thanks again Bill - would be interested to get your opinion on the Rice barrel - something that might be close to something he woulda/coulda/maybe used post 1800?