great plains hunting pouches

[ajrd]

hello, I am ajrd from france  ;its my first topic here, and I am glad to join alr.
I need some help about great plains hunting pouches or rocky mountain bag.
our reference in france are men like tc albert, ken scott and calico factory and  we don't have numerous longrifler there. I try to create a group of folks for 19th trapping and buffalo hunting ect
I made numerous hunting pouches , but I want new design and picture of great plains hunting bag . I don't know what kind of bag were used for bufflo hunting circa 1850, to accomodate my hawken rifle
thanks for your help , friends
arnaud

[BrownBear]

There are lots of sources, but I'm especially fond of the work at Wild Rose Trading in Durango, Colorado.  Chuck Barrows is the owner and a participant here.

[ajrd]

very well , I have ever seen this site . its my favourite , because the belt bag and deerskin pouches with snake shield have a great southwestern look. i ve got a bag patented from a picture of wild rose , in deerskin ...
have you got another sources, unknow from french longrifler , brown bear ?
thanks

[T.C.Albert]

Though the epic hey-day of the buffalo hunter came a bit after the 1850s and involved cartridge rifles, Madison Grant has some very good information about the hunting pouches used in the west in his book "The Kentucky Rifle Hunting Pouch". In the chapter called Westward Winds  (page #125) he addresses mountain man bags as illustrated by western artists like Dreas, and has photos of actual bags like the one made by Kit Carson circa 1858, the famous Mariano Modena bag, and a pouch carried by Texas Ranger/rancher Charles Goodnight.

Pages #135~143 go on to show photos of nearly 40 later western styled bags dated to the period you are intersted in.

If you are not familiar with Grants book, it may be a source you will want to add to your collection. Hope this information is of some help to you in your research...
TC

[Dennis Glazener]

hello, I am ajrd from france  ;its my first topic here, and I am glad to join alr.
I need some help about great plains hunting pouches or rocky mountain bag.
our reference in france are men like tc albert, ken scott and calico factory and  we don't have numerous longrifler there. I try to create a group of folks for 19th trapping and buffalo hunting ect
I made numerous hunting pouches , but I want new design and picture of great plains hunting bag . I don't know what kind of bag were used for bufflo hunting circa 1850, to accomodate my hawken rifle
thanks for your help , friends
arnaud

Arnaud,
Glad to have you aboard, maybe we Americans can help you like your forefathers did for us during the American Revolution! I am sure there are lots of folks here that will be glad to help you with early American leathercraft. Welcome, have fun.
Dennis
 

[hanshi]

Welcome to the forum, arnaud.  A lot of help is available here so make yourself at home.

[Chuck Burrows]

Though the epic hey-day of the buffalo hunter came a bit after the 1850s and involved cartridge rifles

Tim while that's true to a point,  buffalo hunting for robes and tongues started long before the hide hunters of the 1870's. By the mid 1830's several thousand robes a year were being shipped east. By 1846 for instance G. F . Ruxton notes there were no buffalo sighted within 500 miles of St Louis and none were sighted within 200 miles or so of Bent's Fort in east Colorado which along with Fort Laramie in South Central Wyoming were primarily built for the robe and tongue trade.
Also in the north the Metis were trading thousands of pounds of pemmican a year and in the SW the Ciboleros did much the same. Then came the meat hunters in the 1850's and 1860's. This early hunting of a buffalo though little is written about it, had a huge impact on the herds since most of the buffalo taken for robes and meat were cows and calves.

Here's a pic of a documented meat hunters outfit from the late 1850's.


For bags used by the mountain men of the 1830's check out the works of AJ Miller here:
http://art.thewalters.org/viewartist.aspx?id=4486#results
this is a bag I made based on the works of Miller - it could be made without  the beadwork and still be "proper" - it represents an Indian made bag rather than a commercially made bag from the east.

[T.C.Albert]

You are definitely right Chuck...thanks much for the clarification...
I think I just skipped ahead to the much romanticized "Big .50" days
giving the wrong impression about buffalo hunting overall...
thanks again..
TC

[omark]

not to change the subject, but would that be a loading block in the picture??    mark

[Chuck Burrows]

yes it is - but remember the date on this set is 1857-1865.....the period it was used by the original owner.....

[omark]

right, chuck, but some people seem to think they werent used that early.  do you (or anyone else) know of documentation of earlier use??    thanks, mark

[longcruise]

TC, maybe you need to do another book dedicated to bags of the RM fur trade and westward expansion period.  Along with patterns of course!

[ajrd]

Thanks you to all, friends , for your advices and pictures .

mr albert, your work is a kind of reference where i am living and I enjoy to read you and see your pouches .
sure, my next purchase are 'the kentucky rifle h pouches" and your book 'how to recreate ......." all two a good sources of reference..

dennis, you're a forefather too, you american did a lot for us during ww2 , thanks for your words .

mr barrows, your bag is very nice  as all your work at wild rose ... in french prairie reanectment we use the terms of "roots" about such work, especially destined to campaigner events in mountains. frenchlongriflers want to recreate this kind of patterns , deeply roots and native .....
and we use your picture as references...

well, I can go to work now , to realize a early bufflo set , to draw the pattern ect...
see you soon
ajrd (from french longriflers and french mess cw reanact)