Counter sinking and pilot holes

[Tom Currie]

What methods do you guys use the make sure a patchbox or buttplate countersink lines up with the pilot hole for the screw ? I have tried drilling the pilot hole and countersink at the same time with the almost completed rifle in vice but the finished buttstock doesn't hold well for me in square vice jaws for both operations. Thoughts appreciated.

[Dave Dolliver]

Some years ago I obtained some piloted counter sinks from MSC (Manhattan Supply Corp).  They work quite well at keeping the countersinking aligned with the screw hole.  Haven't checked recently as to their availability.  The pilots are replaceable and were available in various sizes.

Dave Dolliver

[keweenaw]

I drill and countersink the holes in the metal before I drill the pilot hole in the wood for the screw.  I don't clamp the metal when drilling, just center punch deeply and put the piece on top of a block of wood in the drill press vise aligned so my hole will be perpendicular to the surface.  A good unpiloted counter sink will stay centered on the pilot hole.  I don't really have much problem then marking and drilling the pilot hole in the wood.  A very good way to make sure that pilot hole in the wood doesn't wander off center is to put it in with a gimlet.

Tom

[Jerry V Lape]

Snyder, what makes a countersink a "good countersink"?  And how do you get the pilot hole in the tang started perpendicular to the surface?  Getting the pilot hole started correctly just bedevils me no end. 

[keweenaw]

On a good countersink, KEO or other major name brand, US produced.  I use multiflute ones.  It's easy to get the hole started perpendicular to the surface.  You put a block of wood in the drill press vise sticking up far enough that the toe of the buttplate will clear the table, rest the tang of the BP on the wood and put a small level on the tang.  Adjust the angle of the wood until the top is level.  The drill then has to go in perpendicular to the surface.  Drill the hole, take the bit out and replace it with the countersink and countersink.  Buttplates are big enough and easy enough to hold that I haven't found it necessary to clamp them. Just use care when you cut through. There isn't anything wrong with using piloted countersinks either but I haven't found it necessary for this application.

Tom

[D. Taylor Sapergia]

For drilling screw holes and then countersinking them in butt plates, breech tangs, and patchboxes, I just eye-ball them for perpendicular.  I use appropriate blocks of wood to elevate a part such as a butt plate tang, to get it perpendicular to the drill bit.  For a patch box, I drill the holes in the brass before it is curved to mate with the wood, but don't countersink them until the brass is fully inlet.  Once inlet, a sand bag on the drill press table can be manipulated to make the countersink bit perpendicular to the stock.

[kutter]

Thin sheet stock can be a problem because as the counter sink is cut, the original hole drilled for the screw
in it is usually enlarged. It can wander a bit from the hole in the wood.
On thin sheet metal like a toe plate or patch box, I've drilled the hole for the screw in the metal first where it needs to be,,this can be done off the gun stock.

Then clamp the metal part in postion in it's inlet.
Now,, assuming the metal is 'sheet metal' and the inletting is close,,meaning there isn't a void under the hole you just drilled,,,I then countersink the hole to the depth I want.

As the hole countersink is cut,,the point of the countersink will cut a perfect center in the wood below it for the screw hole. That center cut into the wood below it ends up being where the center of the screw hole needs to be.

Then I take a drill of the correct size for the screw I'm going to use. I take the point and grind it to a sharp narrow point. It looks kind of like a piloted drill. The small diameter sharp point will follow the center cut from the countersink nicely and put your drill right down in the center of the sheet metal hole.

I did at one time first use a small diameter drill to center drill then follow up with the correct size drill for the screw size. But doing it once is better I think. Less chance of going off the mark.

I do this free hand while the gun or other project is in a vise. I usually use an electric drill, though I have in the past used a hand rotary drill.
You have to eye ball it to make sure you're at 90degrees to the surface like any other work done w/o the use of a mill/drill machine set up & levels,,but other than that it works out great.