Author Topic: Id Maker, possibly OHIO? (Read 7909 times)

Longknife · « **on:** February 26, 2012, 07:16:49 PM »

Can someone ID this signature from a poss. Ohio gun? I will get pictures later, when I have gun in hand, this is all I have now.. Thanks, Ed

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Majorjoel · « **Reply #1 on:** February 26, 2012, 07:40:29 PM »

Looks a lot like "ED HAMBURG"

Sorry Ed, will need a better picture to tell for sure.

smokinbuck · « **Reply #2 on:** February 26, 2012, 09:31:14 PM »

Ed,
Will be glad to try to help but will have to have a better picture. Looks like "possily" E. J. or L. somethnng.
Mark

The other DWS · « **Reply #3 on:** February 26, 2012, 11:56:45 PM »

I copied the pic into photoshop, converted it to greyscale and played with the contrast a bunch of different ways to see if it made any difference.

It looks to me like the E is clear. The second initial might be an L or possibly a J The more I look at it think its a J. Its clearly not the same as the letter starting the last name
The last name I am pretty sure starts with a P, but it might be a J if the second is an L.
The second letter is probably an A or an O followed by 3 or possibly 4 that are illegible.
It looks a little like it might maybe possibly say Johns, but I'd not bet yesterday's breakfast on it. WAS there an ohio gunsmith by the name E L Johns?

Are signatures like that more likely to be a maker or an owner?

more pictures

smokinbuck · « **Reply #4 on:** February 27, 2012, 01:04:02 AM »

DWS,
I have one listing for an Edward H. Johns in Toledo, Ohio, Lucas County. He was contemporary, 1915-1950, and handled mostly parts for the Union Firearms Company. I have listings for Edwin H. Johnson, San Fransico, Ca. 1864-1866 and Eric Hamden Johnson Connecticut 1927-1937. That's as close as I can come.
Mark

T*O*F · « **Reply #5 on:** February 27, 2012, 02:03:21 AM »

Probably the most logical choice is J.H. Johnston, Great Western Gun Works, Pittsburgh, PA. He was a large retailer, wholesaler, and importer to the gun trade and sold his own line of muzzleloaders offering Nos 11, 12, 13, and 14 common rifles, Nos 15 thru 19 Fine Sporting Rifles, and a No. 20 Horseback rifle with 4 options. He also offered double rifles, and single and double shotguns Nos 11 thru 149.

The other DWS · « **Reply #6 on:** February 27, 2012, 02:30:55 AM »

I don't know, that E is pretty clear and the name is not very professionally engraved and I looks like it might over run the little flanking marks a bit. Like maybe it was cut/scratched in after the flanking marks were made. The flanking marks are regularly and deeply cut, like someone who had a little experience at engraving had done them. the name looks like it was written on like you would a signature and then lightly scratched or maybe etched with acid into the steel-----pure speculation of course based on a less than high resolution and professionally lit photo

was it common for a builder to leave a space for a buyer to scratch his name on the upper flat?

It'll be real interesting to see what further examination shows. fun to find out exactly how far wrong we are

Shreckmeister · « **Reply #7 on:** February 27, 2012, 02:52:07 AM »

There are several owners of j h johnston's on this website and I'm sure they could clear that up it doesn't look like it to me.

smokinbuck · « **Reply #8 on:** February 27, 2012, 03:16:55 AM »

I have to agree that the first letter is definitley "E". 2 of the 3 that I found don't make sense given their dates.
Mark

T*O*F · « **Reply #9 on:** February 27, 2012, 05:33:51 AM »

Quote

There are several owners of j h johnston's on this website and I'm sure they could clear that up it doesn't look like it to me.

Just looked at it on my other computer with a better screen. Now that I can see it better, it's definitely not a Johnston.

Longknife · « **Reply #10 on:** February 28, 2012, 08:20:22 PM »

Thanks guys, for all the help. I really like that Ebenezer L Hosick, I can almost make out a "k" at the end of the signature and Guernsey county is one county east of Muskingum County where Zanesville is the county seat....and ....this gun gas a perc. lock marked' C. W. Potwin Zanesville Ohio....Potwin, who died in 1901 was a banker and merchant in Zanesville. I'll post more pictures when I can get them taken....All you help is greatly appreciated.....Ed

P.S The Ohio Longrifle web site list Charles W. Potwin on their gunsmith list...

P.S.S.

Quote from: Majorjoel on February 26, 2012, 07:40:29 PM

Looks a lot like "ED HAMBURG" Sorry Ed, will need a better picture to tell for sure.

Joel, I'm not THAT old!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The other DWS · « **Reply #11 on:** February 28, 2012, 10:45:00 PM »

Looking at it again, I can see the letter I interpreted as a script P might also be the initial florid down stroke of a script capital H, with the initlal line of the first small letter being the second stroke of the H. the following letters are guessable at the very best.

It might be interesting to see if the local historical society had any signed documents by him to compare his written signature.

Longknife · « **Reply #12 on:** March 02, 2012, 06:24:38 PM »

I sent a picture to Rod Frazer, of the Association of Ohio Longrifle Collectors, and he confirmed that the signature is identical to an E.L. Hosick rifle in his collection. His even has the same Potwin lock----Mystery solved-----Thanks for all your help, Ed

8905c · « **Reply #13 on:** March 03, 2012, 03:00:55 AM »

Did you just acquire the gun? I would like to hear some history on it. I am from Guernsey County and I am always interested in Guernsey County rifles. I believe this rifle originated in the Kimbolton area.

8905c

Longknife · « **Reply #14 on:** March 03, 2012, 05:31:57 PM »

8905c, Yes I just aquired it and I know nothing of its history and very little about Hosick except he was married in 1848 and died in 1901. If you have any info about him I would like to hear it....... Thanks, Ed

CORECTION, After giong over my info I discovered that it was C.W. Potwin, whose name is in the lock, that was married in 1848 to Sarah Sturges. His will was filed in 1901, I have no dates on Hosick....Ed

8905c · « **Reply #15 on:** March 04, 2012, 12:11:26 PM »

Ed -

About the only thing I can add is that the family was originally from Ireland and were early settlers in Knox Township, Guernsey County. His wife's name was Elizabeth and they had a daughter, Arabella, who was born about 1854. Apparently, two spellings of the name have been found - "Hosick" and "Hosack". It is noted that a couple of his guns that have been found have a "National Road" patchbox on them, which appears to be fairly ornate. The information above came from the book, Ohio Gunsmiths & Allied Tradesman, by Don Hutslar.
Just curious, did you find the rifle in the Guernsey County area? I have a brother living in the west and he located a John Hixson rifle, also from Guernsey County, in Albuquerque, New Mexico. I always found it intriguing how these old rifles turn up where they do.

8905c

Longknife · « **Reply #16 on:** March 04, 2012, 06:54:43 PM »

89, I found it for sale on a website, from a large gun dealer in North Carolina. This dealer knows NOTHING about antique guns as it was listed as a "Potwin musket" !!!!! Yes, I guess It does have the "National Road" patch box, if by that you mean a four piece box that is 10 inches long with eleven piercings!!! That is what got my attention and enticed my to purchase it ( I don't need a whole lot of "enticeing"). I was wondering if it was original to the gun, and after inspecting it I am sure that it is. After I do a couple of necessary repairs to it I will post some pictures. Thanks for the info on Hosick....Ed

8905c · « **Reply #17 on:** March 05, 2012, 06:32:06 AM »

Ed -

Interesting story and it sounds like a nice rifle. I am anxious to see the pictures.

One of thing I thought of - at Salt Fork State Park, which is near Kimbolton, Ohio, there is a cave located on the state park property that is named "Hosak's Cave". As I mentioned in my previous email, there were a couple of different name spellings noted. In recent years, a couple of people hiking above the cave have fallen over the cliff and lost their lives. If you go to You Tube and enter: Winter At Hosak's Cave Salt Fork State Park, you will see a short clip of the cave. I can't help but wonder if the builder of your rifle, or his family, owned the property where the cave is located at one time.
8905c

Longknife · « **Reply #18 on:** March 06, 2012, 06:14:16 PM »

89, You are right, after looking real close at the signature it is not HOSICK, Its HOSACK!!! I found a lot of Hosaks' in Ohio. I found old Ebenezer made his way to Jacksonville IL by 1872 and finally to MO where he was put to rest at the age of 57, in Henry county MO. I wonder if he continued his trade in these states? HE is not listed in The Gunmakers of IL books....That cave is pretty cool, has anyone explored it? Maybe its full of GUNS!!!!...Thanks, Ed

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Author Topic: Id Maker, possibly OHIO? (Read 7909 times)

The other DWS

The other DWS

The other DWS