Author Topic: Shading gravers  (Read 5784 times)

Offline Lucky R A

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Shading gravers
« on: May 15, 2013, 02:34:48 PM »
     I am presently working on a re-creation of a Henry Albright rifle.  In his engraving of the horse head patchbox of this rifle, Albright used a shading graver that was .90 wide with 8 lines.  I have not had much luck in finding a variety of shading gravers.  I have built several using sections of a file cut and brazed to a graver shank.   This has produced a 6 line graver, a bit too coarse and just not the right result.  Anyone with any sources for good shaders?
Thanks
Ron
"The highest reward that God gives us for good work is the ability to do better work."  - Elbert Hubbard

Offline Larry Luck

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Re: Shading gravers
« Reply #1 on: May 15, 2013, 02:52:04 PM »
Ron,

Hope you are well.

Here is a link to an English company.  At about $40, the tool is a little dear.

http://www.suttontools.co.uk/hand-tools/engraving-tools/shaders.html

There may be other sources, but this was the first I came across with the search "traditional engraving tools shader" on Google.

Larry Luck

Offline Acer Saccharum

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Re: Shading gravers
« Reply #2 on: May 15, 2013, 03:25:47 PM »
Look up liner gravers on Otto Frei: http://www.ottofrei.com/Muller-Liner-Gravers

There's a description of pitch and width. Consider you can get a wide one and grind off lines you don't want.
Tom Curran's web site : http://monstermachineshop.net
Ramrod scrapers are all sold out.

Offline Lucky R A

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Re: Shading gravers
« Reply #3 on: May 15, 2013, 04:49:33 PM »
   Thanks guys.  Tom It looks like you might have a winner if I have my math and mm right.  Next I have to get it in my hands and develop the skill to accomplish the cuts.  This is a great project on a gun built by Andreas Albrecht's son.

Ron
"The highest reward that God gives us for good work is the ability to do better work."  - Elbert Hubbard

Offline Acer Saccharum

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Re: Shading gravers
« Reply #4 on: May 15, 2013, 05:32:15 PM »
Just a heads up: liners make cuts that look like liners did the shading. all four or six lines start at the same time. When shading around a shape, this can have a 'stepped look' to the shading. When you cut each shading line, one at a time with a graver, the results are a more gradual look, and a less obvious start point for the shading. I wish I had a photo to show what I mean.

Tom Curran's web site : http://monstermachineshop.net
Ramrod scrapers are all sold out.

Offline kutter

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Re: Shading gravers
« Reply #5 on: May 15, 2013, 06:29:12 PM »
Frei is an excellent source for gravers. With most of the trades going with air assisted tools and small square shanked tool bits, the traditional tools are harder to find.
Even Brownells and the like used to have a couple of pages of just gravers for sale. That's long gone.

Use a light cut with a liner in shading. You only want the individual lines to be cut, not deep enough to engage the front edge of the tool itself.
That technique  can be used in background removal where you want to remove metal deeply, evenly and leave the surface lined as well.
If you cut too deep while shading and dig the tool face in, it'll show up glaringly as something other than a row of fine shadeing cuts

There's no heal on the tool, just the face angle, so it doesn't like to go around corners well. The light cuts are again in order to avoid digging a furrow behind the tool as you turn.
No heal also means a weaker point.

Use it by hand or with a hammer.
Try the 'bent' liner tools for hand graver work if you get a chance. I find them more comfortable for that. Everyone is different though and the simple straight shank tools may do just as well. The straight shank liners for hammer work .

Quite commonly used in jewelry work, a bit less so in gun work but still common to see.
Liners can be rolled into and out of the work to mimic the variance of start and stop lines of single cut shading. The always perfectly parallel lines give it away as liner work, but it does look nice when well handled.

'Best' quality work is single line cut shading. But in restoration or strict replications, you use what the piece demands.

Some practice, a light touch and you'll be on your way.
 

Offline Acer Saccharum

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Re: Shading gravers
« Reply #6 on: May 15, 2013, 06:36:33 PM »
On bent gravers, cut the graver back to where you get the best angle of attack for your work. As supplied, there is too much bend in them for my taste, so I cut off 1/2 to 3/4" to get the right approach angle. It's about keeping the liner in the work, not skittering across it!  :o
Tom Curran's web site : http://monstermachineshop.net
Ramrod scrapers are all sold out.

Offline Jim Kibler

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Re: Shading gravers
« Reply #7 on: May 15, 2013, 06:38:10 PM »
I'm not sure how Albright did it, but there is a way to sharpen a liner to get more of a random start and stop to the cut.  This will be hard to explain, but I'll try.  If the face angle is sharpened to a curve and not a flat plane, the line created from the intersection of it and the bottom of the graver will also be slightly curved.  This means the center of the graver will engage in the cut first and come out last.  

Offline Bob Roller

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Re: Shading gravers
« Reply #8 on: May 15, 2013, 06:39:15 PM »
I need a two line metal checkering file to put a pattern of
checkering inside a trigger.Does anyone have one that I can
buy or tell me where to find one?

Bob Roller

Offline Nate McKenzie

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Re: Shading gravers
« Reply #9 on: May 15, 2013, 11:36:26 PM »
I got mine from a local jeweler who does engraving.

Offline Habu

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Re: Shading gravers
« Reply #10 on: May 16, 2013, 01:40:09 AM »
Bob, I ground-down a thread-chasing file for a similar job once.  Layout lines were cut with a needle file, used the modified file for the checkering, then pointed up with another needle file. 

Offline Acer Saccharum

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Re: Shading gravers
« Reply #11 on: May 16, 2013, 03:56:55 AM »
Back to Jim's thoughts about a curved bottom graver, I was looking at some of the engraving detail of Albright's work, and it seems the surface he was lining had been curved with scrapers/chisels before the liner was put to it. Is that possible, or practical?

Also, you could make your own convexly bottomed liner. Curve the blank, then cut lines on it with a flat bottom liner. Maybe.
Tom Curran's web site : http://monstermachineshop.net
Ramrod scrapers are all sold out.

Offline Jim Kibler

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Re: Shading gravers
« Reply #12 on: May 16, 2013, 04:29:03 AM »
I was actually referring to a flat bottomed liner graver with a curved face angle.  The cutting edge created from this sharpening would be an arc.  If the tool is used with any angle relative to the workpiece, the center will begin cutting first.  I was sent some photos of Albright engraving and I agree that it seems a standard flat bottomed liner with a flat face angle was used.

Offline Dphariss

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Re: Shading gravers
« Reply #13 on: May 16, 2013, 06:59:56 AM »
I need a two line metal checkering file to put a pattern of
checkering inside a trigger.Does anyone have one that I can
buy or tell me where to find one?

Bob Roller
Brownell's
They list checkering filed from 20 to 75 LPI
http://www.brownells.com/gunsmith-tools-supplies/general-gunsmith-tools/files/metal-checkering-files-prod488.aspx

Dan
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Offline cmac

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Re: Shading gravers
« Reply #14 on: May 17, 2013, 02:05:20 PM »

Offline A.Merrill

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Re: Shading gravers
« Reply #15 on: May 18, 2013, 04:23:27 AM »
    how about some pics
Alan K. Merrill