Author Topic: ALR Museum: Unknown Southern Iron Mounted. "A fine gun" 090212-1  (Read 4948 times)

Offline Hurricane ( of Virginia)

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ALR Museum: Unknown Southern Iron Mounted. "A fine gun" 090212-1
« on: February 13, 2009, 06:25:43 PM »
This rifle is thought to be an excellent example of a typical "southern " period
longrifle. The URL is added to direct you to this specific guns as there are now several in the Museum southern gun exhibit section.

http://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=3286.0

Please add your comments here by posting a "reply".
« Last Edit: February 15, 2009, 07:35:39 PM by hurricane »

Arnie Dowd

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Re: ALR Museum: Unknown Southern Iron Mounted. "A fine gun"
« Reply #1 on: February 13, 2009, 07:16:46 PM »
An outstanding example of an untouched Longrifle  -  Thanks

Offline flintriflesmith

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Re: ALR Museum: Unknown Southern Iron Mounted. "A fine gun"
« Reply #2 on: February 14, 2009, 08:40:24 PM »
This rifle appears to be closely related to an iron mounted, walnut stocked rifle in the Museum of Southern Decorative Arts collection. That one was show in one of Wallace's Muzzle Blast articles and differs from this one in having a conventional rifle guard and being carved behind the cheek.

The MESDA rifle also turned up near Roanoke and was in Covington Va in 1962 or so.

Gary

P.S. I believe that whoever said this is a smooth bore was mistaken--I see traces of rifling.
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Offline Dphariss

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Re: ALR Museum: Unknown Southern Iron Mounted. "A fine gun"
« Reply #3 on: February 15, 2009, 06:16:08 AM »
Looks like an 8 groove "smoothbore" to me too.

Dan
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Tony Clark

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Re: ALR Museum: Unknown Southern Iron Mounted. "A fine gun"
« Reply #4 on: February 15, 2009, 06:30:15 PM »
Not only a fine gun but very good written description and photos on this one. Thanks so much for taking the time. Regards, TC

Offline J. Talbert

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Re: ALR Museum: Unknown Southern Iron Mounted. "A fine gun" 090212-1
« Reply #5 on: February 16, 2009, 06:17:25 AM »
Great condition!  I love the classic features executed in iron.  Sideplate is very reminiscent of a golden age gun.   The patchbox design and hidden release, the shape of the butt piece, and the shape of the tang also seem to be golden age influenced.

Very nice rifle...
Thanks for the pictures,

Jeff
« Last Edit: February 16, 2009, 06:19:46 AM by Jeff Talbert »
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Offline G-Man

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Re: ALR Museum: Unknown Southern Iron Mounted. "A fine gun" 090212-1
« Reply #6 on: February 18, 2009, 07:08:09 PM »
Gary - there does seem to be some association with the MESDA gun (pretty much the gun that hooked me on iron mounted southern rifles) - particularly the buttplate.  Also-  the sideplate is very similar to the other stepped wrist, iron mounted gun shown in Whisker's book that he attributes (not sure why) to Christiansburg, Montgomery County. 

The toe plate is yet another variation on the style that Wallace pointed out in his articles - i.e. the plate or portions of the plate do not extend across the full width of the toe of the stock - another feature that seems to tie it to the area somewhere south and west of the Botetourt County area or beyond into Tennessee or Kentucky.  The toeplate and sideplate have similar elements to those used by Jacob Young, but are more simplified - I don't think he made this piece. 

Years ago I recall seeing a smoothbore stocked up with an iron buttplate similar to this gun, musket style guard, and patchbox, that had come out of the Bardstown Kentucky area - can't remember if it had a cheekpiece or not, but the gun had a similar feel to this one.

I really enjoy these guns that appear to be sort of a transitional style, geographically if not from a time/ evolution standpoint, between the well known, fancier brass-mounted styles made in the east and the iron mounted pieces made deeper in the Appalachians.  They exhibit sort a mix of characteristics of both regions.  Given the timeframes and routes of settlement, they seem to maybe be an evolutionary step that pre-dates the more severely plain iron mounted guns with stylized mounts that became prevalent in Southwestern Virginia, western North Carlolina and Tennessee by the 1820s.  However, given that southwestern Virginia and  upper East Tennessee were settled for quite a while by the time this gun was made, I also wonder if the style could reflect simultaneous influences from geographic proximity to both styles - such as the Valley or Rockbridge/ Augusta on the north/east and southwestern Virginia on the west and south.  Fun to ponder.

I like to imagine a gun like that being carried and used on the mountain or Cumberland frontier areas in the closing years of the wars with the Chickamauga Cherokees, by someone on either side.  Just  a great, untouched looking piece from the photos. 

The guard may have been reused from a military/ militia musket, but for some reason it looks to me like it was made for this gun - I can't really explain why- it just doesn't give the impression of being "reworked" as as you usually see on reused parts.  Given the apparent timeframe (right around 1800 would be my guess) I would think it is forged rather than cast.  If it is cast, it would be a later replacement and I don't think that is the case given the pristine condition overall.

The nosecap is described as one-piece - is it open on the front end (looks like so in the photos) or swaged up to cover the front of the wood?

Guy
« Last Edit: February 18, 2009, 10:20:26 PM by Guy Montfort »

virginiaflintlock

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Re: ALR Museum: Unknown Southern Iron Mounted. "A fine gun" 090212-1
« Reply #7 on: September 12, 2013, 09:53:40 PM »
im new, why can i not see this post?

oakridge

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Re: ALR Museum: Unknown Southern Iron Mounted. "A fine gun" 090212-1
« Reply #8 on: September 12, 2013, 10:18:32 PM »
It's not just you. I can't get it either. Says it's missing or off limits to me. Has this rifle been removed?

Offline Hurricane ( of Virginia)

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Re: ALR Museum: Unknown Southern Iron Mounted. "A fine gun" 090212-1
« Reply #9 on: September 13, 2013, 04:03:57 AM »
I have no idea why it is not visible. It is not visible to me , either? The URL may be incorrect as the gun opens from the Library under "Iron Mounted Long rifles."
Hurricane
« Last Edit: September 13, 2013, 04:08:47 AM by Hurricane ( of Virginia) »