Damascus

[eddillon]

For those interested in Damascus barrel, here is a link to a very interesting site:

https://sites.google.com/a/damascusknowledge.com/www/home

[PPatch]

Very interesting - Thanks. Does anyone know of any contemporary makers using Damascus for muzzle loading barrels (other than SxS's)?

dp

[Bob Roller]

George Suiter,an old friend and gunmaker at Williamsburg built a superb copy of an Alex Henry Sporting and Target rifle with a Damascus barrel rifled by Ed Rayl.

Bob Roller

[eddillon]

Very interesting - Thanks. Does anyone know of any contemporary makers using Damascus for muzzle loading barrels (other than SxS's)?

dp

Would like to find out if there is a true Damascus barrel available.  Pistol length is OK.  Damasteel from Sweden is available but at great cost.
I recall that there was some one in Pennsylvania who made a Damascus rifle barrel a few years ago.

[Whaleman]

I have always thought that Damascus was a shotgun type of barrel. Can anyone give me a link to a Damascus rifle? Thanks Dan

[Captchee]

Dyson and sons have original blanks

http://www.peterdyson.co.uk/acatalog/ORIGINAL_DAMASCUS_BARRELS.html

[FlintFan]

I have always thought that Damascus was a shotgun type of barrel. Can anyone give me a link to a Damascus rifle? Thanks Dan

http://jamesdjulia.com/item/lot-2331-purdey-100-bore-two-groove-express-percussion-double-rifle-with-case-and-accessories-45683/

Single barrel percussion/flint rifles are common as well.  Single barrel rifles look almost exactly like the half stock fowlers you see, except they generally have full octagon barrels, a cheek piece, and sights of course. 

[Captchee]

 here is one made by  John Blanck of london . i saved photos of , but more becouse of the lock and the shape of the barrel vs what the patern barrel . the bore is also  rifled for a belted ball

[Acer Saccharum]

I have a modern made Damascus steel jeager barrel, bored and rifled by Ed Rayle some years ago. So I know they are made occasionally.

There is a firm in England that is selling damascus twist shotgun tubes that can be worked into usable barrels. You'd have to line them if you want a smaller bore.

[Jim Chambers]

I have three such barrels I would be willing to sell.  One pistol, one jaeger and one slender rifle barrel.  All three have liners to make them perfectly safe to shoot.
I'll be back in the shop by noon tomorrow (Mon.) and can be reached at 828-667-8361 if interested in any of these.

[eddillon]

I have three such barrels I would be willing to sell.  One pistol, one jaeger and one slender rifle barrel.  All three have liners to make them perfectly safe to shoot.
I'll be back in the shop by noon tomorrow (Mon.) and can be reached at 828-667-8361 if interested in any of these.

I'll call you tomorrow, Jim.
Ed

[James Wilson Everett]

Guys,

I think that twist iron barrels in the flint period were uncommon, probably found on the higher priced guns, those made for lords and princes and not for guys like me.  The photos posted by Captchee shows one of those top end guns.  If you ever find an original twist iron barrel a good idea is to install a liner just as the post by Jim Chambers.  Then you can have the astounding beauty of the twist iron with a high degree of safety and performance.  Here is a German rifle with an original twist iron barrel.  When I got the barrel (from e-bay) the bore was completely rusted out, think inside out corncob.  I bought a rifled liner from T.J.s and installed it, now the gun has both a beautiful barrel and it also shoots well.  A note here, even with the modern steel liner, I use a modest powder charge, 58 grains in a 0.51 bore.





For a smooth bore I have used tubing as the liner with good results.  It is just as easy as installing a rifled liner, but is a whole lot less expensive.  Here is a German fowling gun with a new made barrel that is lined with a stainless steel liner.  Actually a nuclear grade Inconel 690 tube.  A real cheater!  This may be a useful idea for the repurposing of a lot of 19th c Belgian twist iron barrels.





Note to Jim Chambers:  The lined twist barrels sound wonderful, I hope they find a good home!

Jim

[dbraw]

A few months ago I bought a Damascus blank form a forge in Alabama and sent it to Charles Burton for him to make a octagon to round pistol barrel. It is due to me this month.
Dan B.

[Dphariss]

Those interested in Damascus should read W. Greeners "The Gun" and W.W. Greeners "The Gun and Its Development". Has pretty good explanations of Damascus used in firearms.
There has never been a good, cheap, Damascus gun barrel.
GOOD Damascus barrels were stronger than iron barrels.  W. Greener tells us that in his time barrel forgers would get the fire up and start welding barrels, they would first make a few lower quality barrels and then as the fire got right would start to make first quality barrels. As they were quitting for the night they would let the fire degrade and make a few more lower quality barrels before quitting. At least this is how I remember the process. This difference in the quality is why a cheap shotgun with a "twist" barrel etc  would often come apart with "modern" smokeless ammunition.

Dan

[smart dog]

Hi Folks,
Not that this is important in this thread, but I think it good to be clear about what was and was not "Damascus".  The beautifully patterned barrels on many high-end British pistols and sporting guns during the end of the 18th and beginning of the 19th centuries were not "Damascus".  They were "stub twist" barrels made from mostly horseshoe nails and contained little steel.  The iron from the used nails had a more uniform density and quality than was typical of iron available for gun barrels at the time.  It was similar in quality to the fine Spanish iron coming from northern Spain and made excellent barrels that were strong, light, and patterned like a slab of marble rather than the regular patterns seen in "Damascus" barrels.  They are "stub twist" barrels, some of the best made by William Fullerd and his brother Thomas, that were used by Twigg, Wogden, the Mantons, Nock, and many of the other great British makers at the apex of their careers.

dave

[Captchee]

 very good point Smart dog

[Acer Saccharum]

I also have a Turkish barrel that is pattern welded, probably from 1650 AD. Said to have been a battlefield relic from the Battle of Vienna.

[smart dog]

Hi Folks,
I made an error in my explanation.  I should have checked my references before opening my mouth.  Stub twist barrels did incorporate steel as a lamination, which would explain the pattern when browned but it was not the "Damascus" process of twisting together wires of steel and iron, thus the irregular pattern.  The steel content was low and often came from springs such as those used for carriages and wagons.

dave

[John C IND]

I once had an original half-round, half-octagon patent breeched bottom-ribbed barrel that read 'REMINGTON STUBS TWISTED' on the diagonal flat ahead of the snail.  It had a 1.090" bore.  In the sunlight, you could see a twist or stripes in the finish.
We could barely see something like stamping there, and a retired police chief mixed me a reagent to bring it up to see and read. The image only lasted 30 minutes or so...