Barn Gun Question??

[cheyenne]

On a Barn Gun using a simple pinned trigger, but no Trigger plate, what do you use for the barrel tang....a wood screw? I know on a trade gun the tang bolt can go up through the trigger guard, but say a "Lancaster" patterned barn gun, if you didn't use a trigger plate, what would youo use on the tang?  Or is it just always better to use the plate?

[Habu]

I'd inlet a nut (to be covered by the triggerguard), then run the usual screw through the tang and down to the nut.  I've never trusted wood screws in the tang.

Then again, I have "trust issues"!   

[JoeG]

inlet a small piece in front of the trigger. it will act as a trigger stop and accept the tang bolt

[cheyenne]

Thanks! Kind of how my thin king was going.

Are Barn Guns HC?  I mean, there's not a lot of plain guns in ROCA....surely the old masters also had their lower cost models for customers who couldn't afford the fancy guns, or didn't need a lot of decoration, but a did need an accurate, well made rifle.....or is the Barn Gun a more modern variant?

[rich pierce]

There are a number of examples of types of original colonial or Federal flintlock guns without a full complement of furniture.  The earliest examples are fowling pieces, some of them from New England.  Some of these are probably composite guns, stocked up from available parts.  Economy drives the barn gun phenomenon.  Somebody needs a gun as a working tool.  Probably not a primary tool.  Next we see from Berks County and surrounding areas some plain guns from the late flint era, often smooth rifles.  These were most likely farmers guns, for varmints, killing hogs, whatever.  The n even later in the South there're some examples of rifles, which are quite different in having double set triggers and being rifled, that sometimes lacked buttplates, had a simpler guard, might not have a nose cap, etc.

By extension some have assumed that plain guns without a full complement of furniture always existed, but were not preserved, etc, so now they are being made in all sorts of styles and from components from different eras.  And some folks just like them.

[JTR]

A similar topic was discussed here not long ago, and as usual, there wasn't much agreement. Be that as it may, if you want to build such a thing, go for it! A lot of southern mountain guns use a wood screw through the tang with no problem.

As for If there were PA style long Rifles made as a barn gun ( a modern name I believe), IF, you follow a set of parameters that generally describes a long rifle, ie, say pre 1825/1830 flintlock Rifle, you won't find many made as a barn gun. It seems to me, and just my experience through the years that the basic long rifle had a cheek piece, butt plate, side plate, trigger plate, patch box and nose cap.

If you include a fowler type, basic's will be different. Different basic's also if you include later made percussion and half stock guns, rifles, smoothbores, fowlers, etc.

Just my opinion, and others opinions will vary.

John

[Dennis Glazener]

I suspect this will cause a big debate but here goes.

A lot of southern mountain guns use a wood screw through the tang with no problem.

I wholeheartedly agree with JTR. I can not remember having seen an original southern mountain rifle that had problems due to a wood screw/s being used in the barrel tang. I just can't see how a good fitting woodscrew would weaken a wrist as much as a through bolt, in fact I believe I would trust the wood screw before I would a 10X32 through bolt.

Normally the rear lock bolt goes through the breechplug/tang bolster I can't see the need for a through the tang/trigger plate bolt except that its traditional on many rifles.
Dennis

[KentSmith]

I have to second Dennis on this.

[shortbarrel]

Thanks Dennis for your post. Southern Mountain Rifles and Northern barn rifles were built differently.

[t.caster]

My .62 cal Jaeger is now 33 yrs. old and has a wood screw holding the tang. It was my main target rifle for over 22 years and is still my weapon of choice for hunting. No problems here!

[bama]

This a picture of a lug or nut that the tang bolt screws into. The nut is inlet into the stock and sets just above the trigger plate. This is a very famous early american rifle, the reason this was done was because the front trigger spring is bolted to the trigger plate at the front of the plate and would interfer with a tang bolt through the plate.

The front spring keeps just enough pressure on the front trigger to keep it from being loose. Similar to the wire spring on a set of Davis double set triggers.

[Stophel]

As Rich said, in certain instances, "barn guns" are entirely historical.  In others, probably not.  BUT, we all love them anyway, I like them too, "real" or not.

Being as I HATE triggerplates, HATE inletting them, and HATE fitting them to the trigger, I avoid them whenever possible!!!  I put in a nut in the wood for the tang bolt whenever I can.

Maybe you can see the square nut on this "early barn gun"


This is not a "barn gun", but a triggerplate would have been a real pain and interference to the triggerguard. And again, I just hate them...  The nut is completely hidden.  I remember I made the nut a tapered trapezoidal shape so it would fit entirely inside the triggerguard inlet.


On this "musketoon", the only good way I could get everything together was to bolt directly into the triggerguard.  If I recall correctly, I even soldered a steel insert (a larger bolt) into the triggerguard and then drilled and tapped that for the tang bolt.