Sand castings??

[Scota4570]

I have never used them before.  I got a but plate and trigger guard.  To my eye they are awful.  Not just the porosities and roughness but also the shape.  Nothing is straight.  All dimensions are distorted.  The butplate looks like the mould was broken while the metal was semi liquid.   Yes I can bend beat and file.  It will never be just right.  Since I am using the butplace to establish stock contours this seems like a loosing bet.  Unless somebody can convince me otherwise I plan to toss them and get lost wax castings.   

[JCKelly]

Nothing inherently wrong with sand castings

I bet everyone would like to know your source, to factor into their own buying decisions

Reaves Goehring supplies excellent castings.

[Mike Brooks]

No problems with sand cast here, they just aren't as pretty when you start out.

[Bob Roller]

No problems with sand cast here, they just aren't as pretty when you start out.

Sand casting doesn't have to be rough but a lot of it looks like it was done in a mud mould.
I had or maybe still have some malleable iron percussion hammers that were not bad and they were sand castings.

Bob Roller

[Stoner creek]

Look at that casting as you would look at a stock blank. What you want is in there, a little time and elbow grease will get er right out of there!

[Captchee]

 What Bob and mike are saying is true. Sand castings do not have to be rough or distorted .
 When they are its either because someone is reusing the mould to make  a couple 2 casting “YES that can be done “  they are not sifting and reclaiming their sand properly or using a fine sand to start with  .
 
Sounds to me like what you have is a cull  that somehow got missed . I would send it back   melt it down into something else

[flehto]

Actually have used more sand castings than investment casting because of the alloys  sometimes used. The big disadvantage w/ many sand castings is that there's too much brass that has to be removed.

Only build 2 "styles" now....Lancaster and Bucks County and use Chambers' parts for the Lancaster and Goehrings and Hedgecock's  for the Bucks County. Below is a pic of an investment cast Bplate and after a short while, the color of the alloy really contrasts w/ that of the yellow brass.....Fred

 

[ken]

sad castings always look that way ! Just look at them as raw materiel. With hours and a file or two they will be just fine. ken

[D. Taylor Sapergia]

I prefer sand castings to some of the investment cast 'bronze' stuff sold today.  For one thing, as in the example above, you can make what you want from a sand casting, when the actual item is not available.  This is the split guard for a future Wm. Antes swivel breech build.  I made it from a casting, shown below the finished piece, from TOW.  There's enough brass, and nice soft yellow brass too, in those castings to about make two guards, and it all ends up on the floor.  The sand cast brass files easily with a variety of files and rasps, provided you haven't used them on steel prior.  Brass likes a new sharp file.
If you want nice yellow brass castings that do not require so much 'sculpting', buy from Dave Keck and/or Reeves Goering.

[Turtle]

 I had a real bad experience with a sand cast German silver buttplate and trigger guard once. They were so hard I dulled many files, got tired, and ended up rough finishing them on a bench grinder! I stay away from them now.
                                                 Turtle

[bob in the woods]

Don't judge sand castings by a "german silver" example.  I have found so much variance between castings..even between sources.of the so called material.   Personally, I don't like the stuff.  I find it looks "odd", but it was used on some later guns .
I actually prefer sand cast yellow brass to anything else.

[WadePatton]

I prefer sand castings to some of the investment cast 'bronze' stuff sold today.  For one thing, as in the example above, you can make what you want from a sand casting... buy from Dave Keck and/or Reeves Goering.

show that casting who is boss! 

nice work Taylor

[Scota4570]

Thanks for the help.
 I got the butplate close enough for my OCD personality.  The trigger guard is a non starter.  The length/depth  of the bow in insufficient for the Davis set triggers I have.  The bow appears to be for a single trigger.  I have chubby finger so I want a larger bow, like this:

http://jamesdjulia.com/item/2324-358/

Notice how  the bow is a little longer than the grip rail.  Any leads on where to get and "Armstong" trigger guard more like this?  

I tried looking for Reaves Goehring's website.  I he has none??  How do I find what what he makes? 

[PPatch]

Look over Dave Keck's website: http://knobmountainmuzzleloading.com/

Reaves does not have a web presence that I know of. If you can't find what you're looking for call Dave and ask. Good luck.

dave

[Acer Saccharum]

Sand castings can vary wildly in quality and usability. Some castings have so much sand included in the surface that your files get destroyed in a few strokes, and other castings have a grainy pebbly surface that files beautifully. This has a lot to do with the type of sand that was used, the temp of the metal when cast, and general foundry practices. When you find a good foundry, hang onto them as along as you can.

[Mark Elliott]

I think you need to approach this differently.   I don't think you should depend so much on the provided butt piece so much to dictate what the butt stock should look like.   I think you should know what you want the butt stock to look like and make a butt piece to fit.   I do this as I have to make different style butt pieces for different rifles.  While I do develop templates to make certain types of butt pieces that I plan to make repeatedly,  the first one I do, I use the butt stock as a guide for making the butt piece.   I forge a butt piece blank out of which I can file the final product I want.   I shape the butt piece roughly the way I want it to be, then file up the mating surfaces for inletting.    All the final shaping is done on the rifle so that the butt stock is a unified whole.   The butt piece and butt stock are developed together.   

While there are some very nice sand cast mounts, such as those from Reeves Goehring,   you should buy or make something out of which you can get what you want.

[Dave B]

I have never gotten a bad casting from Reves Gorhring. Top of the line all the way yes sand cast but they are soft as butter and a joy to work with. here are a couple pics that have a close size to what your Armstrong guard looks like. Best to confirm with Reves for correctness. I am purly going by the profile for what the example youve given. I like the # 41  and  # 43 They are the third and fourth down from the top. The 6th one is also a possibility.

[Turtle]

 The silver gun was a "pretty" gun I built for free for my sportsmen's club to raffle. It's eye catching appeal served it's propose with the flatlanders. Didn't think of sand being left in it-duh. I never had that trouble with cast brass and assumed it was because it was silver.
                       Thanks,Turtle

[Scota4570]

Reaves Goehring Contact informaition???

I've called 717 684 2022 a couple of times, no answer or message machine.  Is that the correct phone number?

Thanks,

Scot