Soldering problem, need help???

[Bigmon]

Am soldering tenons to the bottom of a round barrel.  Got the good one pc milled tenons from TOW.
Have done allot of regular copper pipe type soldering, no problem.  Also have soldered tenons on before using just good old paste flux and regular solder with no trouble.
But thought I'd try the recomended stuf that TOW sells.
Bought their TIX liquid FLUX and the TIXSOLDER, says the hardest soft solder on earth.
That must mean the "HARDEST TO USE".  Cause I've tried three times now and it does not stick?
It seems to melt way too easy, it is very thin.
I think it is melting too fast in that the tenon and barrel dont get hot enough before the solder melts and runs away??
Of course I dont want to over heat the barrel??  Which is what I was trying to get away from in trying this??
Anyone know what I'm doing wrong??
This stuff wasnt very cheap, allot more than just using the regular old solder?
Help would sure be appreciated!!
Thanks so much

[jerrywh]

  When soldering the lug to the barrel with tix solder don't heat the lug. Place the tined lug on the barrel after fluxing the barrel. Hold it in place and heat the barrel not the lug. Don't use past flux. Use the tix flux. or use a liquid flux. Past flux is for a higher melting solder and won't work with tix. 

[blackbruin]

try tinning the underlug first, than pounding a piece of solder very  flat and put between barrel and tennon with flux on, cllamped, should see it suck in once you reach the solders melting point.  May not be the best advice but its what i do.

[sydney]

Hi--some those soldiers are hard to use--For me it usually the temperature
      Too low and the soldier will just bead and not flow
       Too high and the flux will burn
       I clean very well then I tin both pcs
       try not to get the torch in direct contact with the flux
       Clean and add new flux
        Hold pcs and heat-try just heating just the barrel from underneath
         when the soldier melts on the barrel add a bit of soldier
           Hope this helps
               Sydney
          
 

[LRB]

  I suspect that you are burning the flux. I have never had good luck with TIX. For me, it doesn't seem nearly as strong as advertised. Especially over time for some reason. I would suggest you use STAY BRITE, and it's proper flux, or common plumbers solder.

[Mark Elliott]

When soldering,  it is generally best to tin both sides first.   Also,  the parts need to mate as perfectly as possible before tinning.   Solder, just like glue, needs to be thin for high strength.  Don't think that you can fill gaps with solder.  The trick to a neat solder or brazing job is to only clean and flux where you want the joint.   The solder will only flow properly where the surface is clean and fluxed.   When you heat, you heat the metal behind/under the solder until it flows and then STOP.  

With solder-on barrel tenons or front sights, you need something to hold the piece in place while you add heat to allow the solder to flow together.  I use a piece of 1/2" wide 5-6" long spring steel that has a 1/2" 90 degree bend in one end with a V notch in that end.   It should look like a long rear sight.  You then clamp the spring to the barrel such that the little V notch holds your tenon or sight in place on the barrel.  

 Then heat the barrel slowly below the joint (perhaps momentarily hitting the tenon or sight) until the solder flows and then STOP!  You only need 500 degrees, but you do need to heat the entire joint to that temperature.   Use a rosebud tip on your torch and/or move it around a lot.   Don't over heat, or all your solder will get sucked out of the joint.   I suspect that is one of your problems.  You just want to apply the right amount of heat at the right spot for the right period of time.   I know that can sometimes be challenging, but that is the goal.  Soldering gun work is not like soldering copper pipes together.   Pipes are a lot more forgiving.    

[David Rase]

If you cannot get solder to work then cut dovetail.  I cannot remember the last time I soldered an under lug to a barrel, round and oct/round included.  Dovetailing allows for a thinner forestock.  Many original fowlers and the Brown Bess were dovetailed.  .020" - .030" on a thin round barrel is more than enough.
David 

[PPatch]

Be SURE to oil your bore right after soldering! The heating inside the bore can (and probably will) cause flash rust to form.

dave

[jerrywh]

 Tix melts at about 275° F.  You won't oxidize the barrel with that temp.  Actually tix is not a good solder for that purpose. You need something like stay bright. Stay bright flows at about 430° F.  Most hardware stores stock a solder that is about 6% silver and flows at around  430°.  That's good stuff.  Practice on something else for a while. Don't practice on the gun.  Try not to breath the fumes.
 

[Hungry Horse]

I agree, Stay-Brite is the best. It's strong, and easy to use, but isn't cheap.

   Hungry Horse

[B.Habermehl]

I gotta agree with Jerry on the common hardware store lead free solder, easy to use. Plenty strong enough for lugs and sights. BJH

[Mark Elliott]

I should say that I assumed Stay Bright or something similar in my instructions.    That is what I use for such applications. 

[Stophel]

TIX is way, way, way too soft for much of anything.  I do find it handy for temporarily sticking things together, like sticking a pan on a frizzen to hold it for drilling, but that's about it. 

[Bigmon]

After reading yer opinions and considering my own experience using good old regular solder, I have to admit there is no use trying to re-invent the wheel so to speak.
I'm gonna use the same old solder I use for everything else, including the lugs and sights on seb=veral other rifles that are holding just fine.
I was just tring to improve on something that didnt need improving.
I guess if it aint broke, dont fix it applies here?
Thanks as always.  This is a great web site.

Thanks to all

[Scota4570]

Agreed!  Regular lead tin solder works fine, no improvement is needed.

A tip?  To tin the parts use coarse steel wool. Heat the part, grab a 1/2" wad of the steel wool with solder and paste flux on it, using  needle nosed pliers and rub it in.   It will "tin" the part quickly and evenly. 

[Turtle]

 If you don't want to build a gadget to spring hold the lug to the barrel, you can use a mini wonder bar. Works for ft. sights too. I clamp it to the barrel with the lug under the straighter end with the V of the other end on the barrel. I use the paste solder with flux in it, but still struggle sometimes.
                                                      Turtle