.58 Caliber load, most consistant ball weight, home cast or commercial?

[Bob Rearley]

Gentlemen,
I am sighting in a .58 cal 37inch Rice Barrel.  I am curious about powder loads and patch sizes for 50 yards.  Not so concerned with hunting loads yet.
Thanks in advance, Bob

[JPK]

I shoot a 58 calibre 35" Green Mountain barrel and find the .570" Speer ball to be the most consistent in all respects. The .570 Hornady ball verys in roundness. My rifle shoots to point of aim with 70 grains of 2f Goex at 25 then 80 at 50 yards and 110 at 100 yards all with .022 pillow ticking and spit. I'm not going to be at any nationals but do very well at the local club matches off hand.

[Daryl]

I have a  24" barreled Musketoon that likes 75gr. to 85gr. 2f GOEX.  Note, this rifle has a .574" bore  super tight so I use a .5623" ball and a 10 ounce denim patch- which I measure at .0225' - compressed.  I think my micrometer might run them a bit tighter - at .019" or .020". That is what I use with the .562" ball and what I also used with the .575" I originally tried. Yeah- they were a bit too tight as the rifling was only .003" deep at the muzzle.

In the Kodiak with .008" deep rifling, I used a .574"(Lyman mould) soft lead ball with the same patches as well as a .0235" thick mattress ticking.

If your Rice barrel has rounded rifling - you will probably have to use (If you want clean, ACCURATE shooting) at least a 10 ounce denim patch and a .575" ball. Do not use a smaller ball or you will not seal the charge behind the ball, which not only gives poorer accuracy, but fouling which can build up and causes hard loading and must then be wiped.

.580" + .016" + .016" = .612" groove to groove.  You have to fill that with a compressed combination of ball and patch.

.612" - .575"ball = .370" divided by 2 = at least a .0185" thick patch. A thicker patch is needed to give the necessary compression in the bottom of the grooves. This is necessary to seal the powder gasses behind the ball and give good accuracy.

If your barrel has square rifling, you can use a slightly thinner patch, but in those, we've still found a 10 ounce thick patch is necessary to be competitive.

Commercial balls will shoot just fine - however, home cast balls CAN be much more consistent, ball to ball, in weight and diameter, depending on the skill of the person casting them.

They should look like jewels.




 

[Bob Rearley]

Those balls are to pirty to shoot.  I was using .016 patch, so I'll move up to .022 and try a .575 ball.  I haven't tried casting my own yet but maybe I'll give it a try.
Thanks again guys.

[Daryl]

The odd sewing centre carries denim by weight - that is, 6, 8, 10 and 12 ounce. The 12 ounce denim, I meaure at .030" with compressed jaws calipers, or .025" in the Mitutoyu micrometer, is what I shoot in the big girl, with .684" pure lead balls, or .677" WW balls.
The 10 ounce shoots very well in every one of my other guns.

[moleeyes36]

The odd sewing centre carries denim by weight - that is, 6, 8, 10 and 12 ounce. The 12 ounce denim, I meaure at .030" with compressed jaws calipers, or .025" in the Mitutoyu micrometer, is what I shoot in the big girl, with .684" pure lead balls, or .677" WW balls.
The 10 ounce shoots very well in every one of my other guns.

The local Jo-ann Fabric carries some nice tight woven cotton denim that is marked as 11.5 ounce.  It measures .026 compressed in my calipers.  It works very well in most of my guns with a ball measuring .005 under bore size.

Mole Eyes

[Daryl]

I should note here (again) - that different makes of calipers and micrometers will measure cloth at different thicknesses due to anvil or jaw difference in size, ie: diameter or width as well as possibly different pressure AND methods used in measuring. There are a lot of variables. When I measure .018" OxYoke patches, I get .015" with my calipers and .012" with my mic.  When shooting, these patches act like .015" - too thin, patches.

I have 3 sets of dial calipers and I get 3 different readings on the same piece of cloth at the exact same location. I am currently using a set of Hornady Calipers that I really like. I do now know where they were made or who made them - but - they are nice and perfectly repeatable.

My mic, when cranked down, shows up to .005" thinner measurement than the calipers on the .030" denim's, and .0025" to .003" on the thinner cloth in the .018" to .023" range.

Mole Eyes - that sounds like a terrific all-round patch - even for balls .010" smaller than the bore.

Note also, for loading tight combinations, you must use Plumber's Lead at 98.6% pure - or what we call dead soft lead - like that from the walls of an X-ray room - or old style lead telephone wire casings minus the soldered lines.  Roof septic air vent caps are usually also pure or dead soft lead, as-are the stick-on weights for mag wheels.

[One Eye]

I shoot a 58 calibre 35" Green Mountain barrel and find the .570" Speer ball to be the most consistent in all respects. The .570 Hornady ball verys in roundness. My rifle shoots to point of aim with 70 grains of 2f Goex at 25 then 80 at 50 yards and 110 at 100 yards all with .022 pillow ticking and spit. I'm not going to be at any nationals but do very well at the local club matches off hand.

I do the same thing but with Swiss 1.5 powder. My denim mikes .024.
For the heavy load I use a felt wad on top the powder charge.
Shoot straight,
One Eye

[Bob Rearley]

Thanks again guys.  Above all, this discussion has reminded me of the unlimited number of variables in this pastime.  I'll never forget when at a national shoot I observed pistol shooters using hammers to drive their balls down the barrel. 

[Bob Roller]

Thanks again guys.  Above all, this discussion has reminded me of the unlimited number of variables in this pastime.  I'll never forget when at a national shoot I observed pistol shooters using hammers to drive their balls down the barrel. 

The mallet and the ball starter has be in use for decades among target shooters.
I used it on round ball rifles for years. It's a bad idea for a hunting gun where a
ball smaller that bore size is practical.

Bob Roller

[Daryl]

This reminds me of a test Taylor and I did with '"Voluptuous Virginia" his .50 cal. rifle, Rice barrel and .016" deep rifling. We were using his normal .020" to .022 patch and balls from his new mould, casting .508".

 Further testing is needed, but preliminary testing showed, that if my rifle, I'd be using only that ball and patch combination. A mallet wasn't needed, other than the two at the ends of my arms.

His patches help up very well indeed and since a short starter with short peg is used to get the combination started then down about 6", from there the rifle's rod is more than necessary for completing the task of loading in such a nice, smooth barrel.