Was .36 ever used as an all around caliber?

[Seth Isaacson]

It was always my understanding that the smaller calibers rifles, like .36,.40, 44, etc. were all that was needed for most hunting along the East coast and on into the Eastern frontier, but once trappers started coming up against large thick hided and heavy muscled animals like the buffalo, elk, and grizzly bear they needed something with more knock down power, thus the .50, .54, and larger were more popular out West.  Just because someone wrote such information in some magazine doesn't mean that it was necessarily true, but it does make sense.

.50-.58 were also common military calibers in rifles as we moved west and rifles saw more official use by the military. This was very likely based on the calibers used in many civilian rifles in the late 1700s and early 1800s. It would have also reinforced the use of those same calibers on guns used in the West since the military was most active in that region, and that is what men on expeditions would have used already. The fact that larger calibers were better suited to the larger game naturally helped I'm sure as well. Some of 1830s and later smaller long rifles seem to also be made much more for sport shooting than hunting which likely also explains why they were often smaller bore added to the fact that the game remaining in the East was generally much smaller than that of the West.

[Daryl]

Good point on the military calibres. The government, throughout the 1800's was very good at selling outdated muskets to the population, for hunting and for protection.  A single BP ctg., up until about 1820, carried a .64" ball and 165gr. of musket powder. After 1820, a .65" ball and 135gr.  of higher grade musket powder.

A few "ctgs." would last a fellow having a small calibre rifle, a fair amount of time in powder and lead. Interesting.

.64 and .65 calibre balls would run 390 to 412gr.

[Skirmisher]

What seems to be overlooked here is that although bores smaller than .40 caliber dominated in the percussion period, the round ball projectile largely departed with the flintlock.  In the 1830s. the flintlock all but disappeared in sporting rifles and the round ball was mostly displaced by the picket ball.  A picket ball packed a lot of long-range whollop even if only .36 caliber.  Most of the percussion long rifles I have handled had bores in the .30-.36 range.  Relatively few are larger.  In fact, the biggest percussion hunting rifle in my collection is an N. Kendall from around 1838 at .47 caliber.  It is an unusual exception.

Shooting the picket bullet seems to be a lost art, perhaps largely due to the lack of available moulds.

[Dan]

I had never heard of John Small so I did a quick search. He certainly did beautiful work.
http://jamesdjulia.com/item/lot-2500-important-and-extraordinary-18th-century-flintlock-rifle-by-john-small-of-vincennes-indiana-41831/

Robby

Yep.

[C. Cash]

While conducting family history research in East Tennessee, I've come across some references regarding rifles.  When talking about the rifles that men picked up to protect their home and go to War ca. 1812 onward, the term squirrel rifle is used to describe them.  I would assume 40 and smaller with the 36's, 38's and smaller in there.

"Rhea and Meigs counties(Tennessee) were set-
tled by the same people, coming from Southwest
Virginia and upper East Tennessee in carts and
flatboats, and from North Carolina on foot, bring-
ing their possessions on pack horses. They were
largely of Scotch-Irish descent. The first settlers of
these counties had followed Campbell and Sevier at
King's Mountain, and Jackson at New Orleans.
Their descendants were with Jessup in the Glades
of Florida, and with Scott in Mexico. They were
men who were ready to shoulder their squirrel rifles
and face an enemy, whether he wore the red coat of
a British soldier, the war paint of a savage, or car-
ried the lance of a Mexican."  VC Allen, Rhea and Meigs County in Confederate War

[stuart cee dub]

Enjoyable thread .
Locally here in the upper central part of the nation I remember see quite a few half stock caplocks with heavy barrels , pea sized bores and deep crescent buttplates as having been passed down as family wall hangers in the 70's.

One of the local gunsmiths installed a new drum on one that dated back to the 1840's and the owner took it to shoot at a small rendezvous. As a new shooter 16 years old I was profoundly impressed that something so old still worked and worked well after not having been used in probably a 110 yrs .

It was one of the hooks that got me interested in making my own rifles .

There were a lot of these pea bores around. Cheap to shoot and since there were no game laws per se
you just made do even if it were light for deer. Just the thing if you were a sodbuster and wanted something besides the ubiquitious smoothbore shotgun .
   
These weren't proper plains rifles but a lot more common or at least survived the intervening years in greater number around here .


 

[rhbrink]

Just my thought but if you were working the fields, garden, whatever, barely scratching out a living and a deer or turkey walked by you would grab what ever rifle that you had and shoot it! They did not have the luxury of a choice of rifles probably had a shotgun and a rifle if lucky at that, no game laws just the law of survival.

RB

[OldMtnMan]

Have you ever thought about how much game was wounded and never recovered in those days?

Just because it was all they had in those days. Doesn't make it proper now.

[Daryl]

Good point OldMtnMan. I would hope what is morally correct today, would take precedence over what might be historically correct?

How many grizzlies were wounded by Louis and Clark before they stopped trying to shoot them with those .54's? I seem to recall "Louis" noting his .32 (.36?) had no real effect on them at all - perhaps they were already upset from the .54 balls?

[OldMtnMan]

Which is why so many mountain men died young. Tough life back then.

[Bob Roller]

Have you ever thought about how much game was wounded and never recovered in those days?

Just because it was all they had in those days. Doesn't make it proper now.

To paraphrase John Wayne, "That's for sure,that's for darned sure". The Brits with their
gauge bore rifles had the right idea.A 32 or 36 caliber round ball can't really be considered as
a "stopper" on anything bigger than a red squirrel. Any critter but a child molester deserves as painless
a death as possible.

Bob Roller

[TMerkley]

Have you ever thought about how much game was wounded and never recovered in those days?

Just because it was all they had in those days. Doesn't make it proper now.

Probably why they got to be such good shots. They had to.  They'd starve!!

[OldMtnMan]

Have you ever thought about how much game was wounded and never recovered in those days?

Just because it was all they had in those days. Doesn't make it proper now.

Probably why they got to be such good shots. They had to.  They'd starve!!

I've thought of that a lot. I'm sure some were good shots and were probably natural shots. I question if it was normal though. They couldn't afford to shoot that much. Certainly, not as much as we do in these times.

[oldtravler61]

 Always wonder what really happened back then. We all have thoughts an opinions on what they did an used. But it all boils down to a well placed shot with enough power to get it done. Old saying  " Fear the man who only has one gun" More than likely he knows how to use it.  Oldtravler