I made a thing

[sespe]

I realize this is nothing to you experienced builders, but it is significant for me.  The Kibler Colonial kit can be made with either a brass piece on the end of the patchbox lid or just wood.  I was going to leave it wood, but he included a blank piece of brass that just kept staring at me demanding to be used. 

So I did it.  Used a jeweler's saw for the first time since I was 14.  Cut, filed drilled, sanded, and it now fits.  Slides nice and smooth.  Then I took a picture and saw every little imperfection.  Somebody posted somewhere else about how the camera lets you see mistakes that your eyes miss.  It sure does.

But I'll show it anyway. 

[smylee grouch]

Could you take it off and make another one out of thicker brass?

[Dr. Tim-Boone]

Shoot that looks too nice to be historically correct!!     Nice work!

[Algae]

Good job!!  Next thing you know, you'll be adding relief carving!

Al J.

[stubshaft]

And wire inlays!  Hopefully my Kibler Colonial will be ready soon...

[n stephenson]

That`s a good starting point! . Remove the spring \ latch  and , blend the buttplate  down to it. Don`t start right beside it. Start from the middle of the BP , and taper it out . If you do it right , it will work out fine. . Problem solving is a huge part of gunmaking. Go easy and you can blend that where it will look good. It never hurts to thin the outer edge of a buttplate down , fairly thin around 1 \16  is not uncommon , on many old rifles \guns.  Nate

[Craig Wilcox]

I second what Mr. Stephenson wrote.  ALL of us make "mistakes".  The key to success in any endeavor is how you correct that mistake.


If you look closely at any "masterpiece", whether it be a long rifle, a violin, or a house, you can almost always either see a mistake, or see where one was corrected.


You have done a slam-bang job on that rifle, and have much to be proud of.  Just correct it the best that you can, and move forward.  And YOU are the one who can correct it.


Good luck with that project - I really like what I have seen of it.

[sespe]

Good job!!  Next thing you know, you'll be adding relief carving!

Al J.

I'm sad to say all the chisels are looking at me, but I'm too afraid to touch them.  I need something else to start on.  Even the simple incised scrolls have me scared.

[sespe]

That`s a good starting point! . Remove the spring \ latch  and , blend the buttplate  down to it. Don`t start right beside it. Start from the middle of the BP , and taper it out . If you do it right , it will work out fine. . Problem solving is a huge part of gunmaking. Go easy and you can blend that where it will look good. It never hurts to thin the outer edge of a buttplate down , fairly thin around 1 \16  is not uncommon , on many old rifles \guns.  Nate

Yes, I didn't even notice that until I took the picture.  It was binding up at the final "snap", so I relieved the brass and wood on the lid.  Now looking at the picture I see the plate could have come down instead.

I could still draw it straight and leave an even gap, right?

[n stephenson]

See how on  the rifle you pictured beside it , the buttplate and the backing plate , are blended together. No step between them. Work the BP down to it , replace the spring , and continue. It has taken longer to discuss this than it would have  taken with a good sharp file , to do it.

[smallpatch]

What I would do..... shim the front of the PB dovetail to move the box back a bit.  Then file to match, re file your spring latch.

[sespe]

see, you all are incredible.  Thanks for the ideas!

[n stephenson]

What I would do..... shim the front of the PB dovetail to move the box back a bit.  Then file to match, re file your spring latch.

Dane, is right. Shim it out first , then blend it all.

[Jim Kibler]

Sespe,

If you would like another box lid, just let me know.  We make them fast and will send you another.  No cost.  Should fit just like the first.

Jim

[Scota4570]

Mine ended up too far foreword too.  I used thicker brass.  The latch ended up in a different spot than intended.  Jim has these pretty well figured out, I should have fitted it less and went with what Jim did. 

I did not what to bother Jim for a new lid so I made due.  The latch has the retention notch pre made.  I wish it did not, it would have made it easier to get a perfect fit if I could have put it where I needed it. 

[jerrywh]

 Personally I have never made any mistakes but if I did I would fix it like Mr. Stephenson said. I did break a #8 jewelers saw blade once but I think it was defective to begin with.

[Chowmi]

Personally I have never made any mistakes but if I did I would fix it like Mr. Stephenson said. I did break a #8 jewelers saw blade once but I think it was defective to begin with.

See, even Masters are humble.  I love it! 

Sespe,
Fix what you can, and move on with it. You have great advice here, and if all else fails, Jim Kibler has just offered to send you a new patch box lid. You can’t lose here. Your rifle is going to knock the socks off people who don’t know about these guns, and for people who do know, they will understand the effort of building a rifle as a new guy and give you a pass on the error.
If I were you and wanted to learn, I’d try to fix the error first. Personal pride and satisfaction will reward you greatly for it. If that fails, call Jim and do it right when he sends you the new lid.


This small error is not actually the point here at all. And that is what Jim’s kits are all about. It’s giving the new guy to muzzleloading, or the old guy who doesn’t want to build, a really quality rifle that you just can’t get from the production guns.
You will not find a production gun with better architecture, ,lock, and furniture than you can get from a Kibler kit. Period, full stop. 

And if you get satisfaction from building this rifle, then maybe you will build another from Jim, or another from a blank or a pre-carve. And that is a win for you and for this community.

All the best to you and your build,

Norm.

[sespe]

Thanks again, all.  I shimmed the lid and did some filing.  It is closer now but not perfect.  That's OK, I don't need it to be perfect.  The rifle on the left was built by Walter Cain, and definitely not his first build!  This is only the second rifle I have built.  The first was a Traditions kit I cut down for my son's first rifle.  I intend to use this rifle a lot, I expect it to get dinged up in short order.

Now, I've already caught the building bug, and y'all are to blame.  I look forward each day to the time I can head out to the garage and do something.  I'm still afraid of taking chisels to this wood.  Since my son outgrew the traditions rifle, maybe it's time to sand it down and start over.  And try to figure out funding for my next build.

P.S. To anyone with a child that is bored with you.  My Dad built muzzleloaders.  I was dragged into his shop over and over as a kid.  And I was bored.  He listened to classical music!  Now, some 40 years later, I find myself doing the exact same things he did.  It's amazing what I remember.  I found "scratch stock" on here, and when looking at the pictures I remembered, "Hey, Dad had one of those!"  And then I cut my first straight lines (well, mostly straight) in the stock.   So don't give up on your kids.  It may take them 40 years, but at least one of them will remember what you did and carry on.  (And classical music really helps when trying to cut straight lines.)

[Iktomi]

This has been a good thread to read. I've ordered a Colonial, and it is very helpful to read and see an aspect of the gun that I will be dealing with in the near future. Post more pics of your rifle as it comes along, I'd sure like to see them!

[sespe]

This has been a good thread to read. I've ordered a Colonial, and it is very helpful to read and see an aspect of the gun that I will be dealing with in the near future. Post more pics of your rifle as it comes along, I'd sure like to see them!

Hey Rick, in October I'll be up in Petaluma for a nephew's wedding, maybe I'll have something to show off by then.

The kit is great, everything fits well.  I had some minor troubles with the trigger bumping on some wood, easily fixed.  The lock required 5 minutes of blacking and sanding to fit.  The nose cap fit perfectly the first time.  It's pretty amazing how close Jim could get everything. 
Oh, here's a complaint:  The front barrel lug protrudes down into the ramrod mortise.  I had to file it down!   

OK, a real complaint:  Be ready to spend some time draw-filing the barrel.  That does take time to get right.

[Jim Kibler]

Sespe,

Glad you've gotten it worked out. 

Just to clarify, the brass piece on the end of the wood box is optional.  The box lid is cut such that all that is needed is a bit of sanding to make it flush with the buttplate.  Installing the brass end piece is not the easiest of tasks, especially for those with little experience.   Nothing wrong with leaving it off, so this is what I would suggest for anyone in doubt. 

All the best,
Jim

[DHS]

How did you get the brass to match the compound curve on the end of the box lid?

[Cory Joe Stewart]

Yeah I would leave it be.  Looks great.  They do not have to be air tight. 

Cory Joe Stewart

[Iktomi]

This has been a good thread to read. I've ordered a Colonial, and it is very helpful to read and see an aspect of the gun that I will be dealing with in the near future. Post more pics of your rifle as it comes along, I'd sure like to see them!

Hey Rick, in October I'll be up in Petaluma for a nephew's wedding, maybe I'll have something to show off by then.

The kit is great, everything fits well.  I had some minor troubles with the trigger bumping on some wood, easily fixed.  The lock required 5 minutes of blacking and sanding to fit.  The nose cap fit perfectly the first time.  It's pretty amazing how close Jim could get everything. 
Oh, here's a complaint:  The front barrel lug protrudes down into the ramrod mortise.  I had to file it down!   

OK, a real complaint:  Be ready to spend some time draw-filing the barrel.  That does take time to get right.

  The local range is just a few miles west of Petaluma. Maybe if you have yer rifle up and shooting you could break free from family duties for a couple of hours we could make some smoke and scare the bejeebers outta the kids with the scary black rifles

[sespe]

How did you get the brass to match the compound curve on the end of the box lid?

Well, I didn't.  I got one side slightly lower than the other.  But looking at the other sample, and looking through Shumway's books, I don't think they tried to replicate the entire curve?