Author Topic: Pictures of my longrifle for your assistance....  (Read 4609 times)

Teun

  • Guest
Pictures of my longrifle for your assistance....
« on: June 15, 2009, 03:09:07 AM »
These are some pictures of my gun  that I have taken...I apologize for the poor quality.  As hard as I try I can never seem to get good pictures.  I think this may be a Reading gun, but am not sure. It is 57" long with a barrel length of 41 3/8" inches long.  I was under the impression that this piece was around 1810, but someone has told me it is probably 1830s?  I don't know...the single lock screw has me curious...is this something that was seen on Reading pieces?  Any assistance would be greatly appreciated.  I am very new to all this and am having a blast. 



























longrifle

  • Guest
Re: Pictures of my longrifle for your assistance....
« Reply #1 on: June 15, 2009, 03:27:36 AM »
I am sorry I can't help you much on information but that is a nice looking old rifle.

Offline Tanselman

  • member 2
  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1633
Re: Pictures of my longrifle for your assistance....
« Reply #2 on: June 15, 2009, 05:14:28 AM »
Some of these old rifles have suffered alterations, making it harder to identify them. In this rifle's case, I think there is a good chance the patchbox is a later addition to an originally plain rifle. I base this on the non-standard 3 segment hinge, the odd shape of the finial, wider than expected lid, and the total lack of dark staining in the wood immediately around the patchbox, from the metal (brass) oxides being rubbed off into the wood over many years. The triggers also look rather later than the rifle, if they are original.

I would hazard a guess that the lock is a poor reconversion of a percussion lock lock plate to appear as a flintlock. Most reconversion parts look to be of newer manufacture, and there is a mismatch in style between the plate and the cock. With that said, it's difficult to draw any solid conclusions about this rifle. Even the trigger guard does not show the expected black inside surface from years of oxidation, making the guard suspect as possibly of newer manufacture until more closely inspected to verify its age and correctness to the gun.

I cannot see where the rear sight sits, so cannot tell if the barrel has been shortened. If it sits well behind the rear sight,  then perhaps the barrel has been significantly shortened during its working life. When alterations have occured, it becomes imperative to inspect the rifle hands-on, so that any and all alterations can be determined before making an assessment of origin and age. That is probably the case with this particular rifle. The stock does have a couple of distinctive details. It appears to have a longer than normal wrist, and the top of the comb appears to be flattened, so there are some clues to begin with. But a lot of other questions exist about the gun before any definitive answer is possible. Perhaps more complete photos could shed additional light on this gun, including close-ups of butt plate, toe plate, rear sight, muzzle, barrel wedges or pins, rear ramrod pipe, etc. to give us a few more clues as to its original configuration, and when & where it was made. Hope this helps. Shelby Gallien

Teun

  • Guest
Re: Pictures of my longrifle for your assistance....
« Reply #3 on: June 15, 2009, 02:09:16 PM »
Thanks for the help.  I will try to get some more pictures that you requested and post them.  As far as the barrel, I don't think it has been shortened...on the underside of the barrel the dovetail pin holes have not been altered.  That is my very unprofessional opinion, so I will get a pic of the rear site and more barrel shots. 

You mentioned that this rifle had a poor lock conversion.  I think I have known in the back of my mind that the patch box, and maybe the lock were not original.  However, due to the very rough nature of the barrel at the lock, and the fact that the patch box is full of a hardened wax type substance...is it possible that this was a very highly used gun and is showing its age? 

I really appreciate all the knowledge!!

Dave K

  • Guest
Re: Pictures of my longrifle for your assistance....
« Reply #4 on: June 15, 2009, 04:15:16 PM »
Certainly, but not always, the amount of pitting around the breech leads me to think also that it may have been perc. at one time. Those old perc. caps could really put the pits to the metal and also eats the wood around the front and back of the nipple area in the stock.

Offline Mike Brooks

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13415
    • Mike Brooks Gunmaker
Re: Pictures of my longrifle for your assistance....
« Reply #5 on: June 15, 2009, 05:01:29 PM »
I'll suggest a Carolina gun. I don't believe this gun was built as flint. The box is awfull funky to be an original part of the gun. The triggers also have the 1960's look to them, definitely not hand made triggers.
NEW WEBSITE! www.mikebrooksflintlocks.com
Say, any of you boys smithies? Or, if not smithies per se, were you otherwise trained in the metallurgic arts before straitened circumstances forced you into a life of aimless wanderin'?

Offline mbriggs

  • member 2
  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 559
Re: Pictures of my longrifle for your assistance....
« Reply #6 on: June 15, 2009, 06:01:14 PM »
Please post more photos of both sides of the comb, the wrist and the tang of this rifle.  I cannot tell for sure from what you have already posted, but it looks like this longrifle has an incised craved line along the comb.  Does it end at the wrist with a small beaver-tail tab? From looking at the photos and what I can see of the comb, the stock architecture of the rifle looks like it could be from the Salem School or the Davidson School in North Carolina, but need to see better photos to give a better answer. 

That patchbox does not belong to either school and does look like a later addition.

Michael Briggs   
C. Michael Briggs

Offline nord

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1548
Re: Pictures of my longrifle for your assistance....
« Reply #7 on: June 15, 2009, 06:20:47 PM »
Erosion and pitting say percussion as does the single screw lock. Screw heads say modern.  (At least NOT hand made.)

Triggers and guard? I can't say.

Patchbox is almost certainly an addition. Whether period or modern I have no idea.

Stock appears to be walnut. Could be a period restock, but more likely original. Should the gun have been presented without a patchbox and in percussion, I'd have said a trade rifle. As such it could have been made almost anywhere in the east. The Albany area of NY and the Lancaster area of PA were both centers for the manufacture of such rifles and the walnut might lead me towards the former.

I hesitate to say what others have so politely avoided...

This particular rifle, while interesting, is no work of art. If not a trade gun, then a utility piece. The patchbox and lock seem out of character for the piece as does the inlay.

None of these observations bode well from the viewpoint of value based on artistic merit. I realize that the subject of value was never mentioned and I mean no harm, nor do I wish to insult. My sole intent is to point out to those who are interested (and uneducated) the vast differences between antique long rifles.

In Memory of Lt. Catherine Hauptman Miller 6/1/21 - 10/1/00 & Capt. Raymond A. Miller 12/26/13 - 5/15/03...  They served proudly.

mike e

  • Guest
Re: Pictures of my longrifle for your assistance....
« Reply #8 on: June 15, 2009, 06:59:08 PM »
Is there a name stamped on the barrel about six inches from the breech?
What does the vent hole look like?
What is the story behind the rifle? passed down thru family or bought somewhere?