Author Topic: Oerter rifle  (Read 2037 times)

Offline Eric Kettenburg

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Oerter rifle
« on: November 02, 2020, 08:57:44 PM »
So last night I received this email from an old friend (I am pasting word for word, and also, darn sure getting a drink!):  :o  :o

"Hi Eric,

A local man brought this old rifle into the shop, and wanted to know if it was safe to shoot it.  It was dark and grimy all over, and he wanted to clean it so it would look good over the fireplace, too.  He said there was a copper oval and star, and some faint carving.  He saw faint markings on the barrel that looked like 1774, and he thought it was made in Pennsylvania.  Since he wanted to shoot it, and all the experts say a Pennsylvania rifle should have a German lock, we talked about putting a different lock on it, that would spark good for him.  After I started cleaning it, the oval and star were silver, but varnish painted over the whole gun made it look like dirty copper.  The buttplate and trigger guard were brass, and cleaned up like new, and the new lock was a little bigger, so it covered the old inlet pretty good.  What he thought was carving was narrow strips of silver laid into the stock, and some was missing, so it looked like carving.  I think a couple pieces were brass strips, instead of silver.  Anyway it cleaned up pretty good, and he was really surprised.  The barrel cleaned up good, and he said he might blue it and the new lock later.  A lot of gunk came out of the barrel, and it had a fast twist with more than a full turn.  We shot it a few times, and he seemed happy.  This must have been a fancy rifle, and expensive when it was new.  Here are some before and after pics."


Before:












After:










Strange women lying in ponds, distributing swords, is no basis for a system of government!

Offline Elnathan

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Re: Oerter rifle
« Reply #1 on: November 02, 2020, 09:00:21 PM »
So, which one is your work?
A man can never have too much red wine, too many books, or too much ammunition -  Rudyard Kipling

Offline Eric Kettenburg

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Re: Oerter rifle
« Reply #2 on: November 02, 2020, 09:05:19 PM »
I absolutely promise you, I had nothing to do with this rifle!  Pinky promise.  Posting message from a friend exactly as I received it.
Strange women lying in ponds, distributing swords, is no basis for a system of government!

Offline rich pierce

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Re: Oerter rifle
« Reply #3 on: November 02, 2020, 09:11:22 PM »
Different locks on the 2 guns.
Andover, Vermont

Offline redheart

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Re: Oerter rifle
« Reply #4 on: November 02, 2020, 09:40:06 PM »
Great Halloween prank! ;)
The original is awesome, but the copy didn't quite pull off the same look.
Great workmanship though!
« Last Edit: November 02, 2020, 09:47:36 PM by redheart »

Offline Shreckmeister

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Re: Oerter rifle
« Reply #5 on: November 02, 2020, 09:41:30 PM »
You’re a horrible individual LOL. I was losing my mind as I read that before I got to the pictures. You know there might be more than one guy with an old weak heart on this forum 😄
Rightful liberty is unobstructed action according to our will within limits drawn around us by the equal rights of others. I do not add 'within the limits of the law' because law is often but the tyrant's will, and always so when it violates the rights of the individual.

Offline 120RIR

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Re: Oerter rifle
« Reply #6 on: November 02, 2020, 09:51:13 PM »
Heck...I'm not an "old" guy and my heart was pounding as well!

Offline 120RIR

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Re: Oerter rifle
« Reply #7 on: November 02, 2020, 09:52:45 PM »
Oh...and by the way.  If y'all don't know, Eric is a N.J. native like me and being a wise-a... is simply in our blood. :-)

Offline Eric Kettenburg

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Re: Oerter rifle
« Reply #8 on: November 02, 2020, 11:11:13 PM »
Folks, I'm gonna repeat - I had absolutely nothing to do with this rifle other than posting this for a good friend.  Perhaps he'll wander on by at some point and offer more information!  It's a heck of a piece.
Strange women lying in ponds, distributing swords, is no basis for a system of government!

Offline P.Bigham

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Re: Oerter rifle
« Reply #9 on: November 02, 2020, 11:20:32 PM »
Is the bottom one signed Brooks on the barrel?
" not all who wander are lost"

Offline JTR

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Re: Oerter rifle
« Reply #10 on: November 02, 2020, 11:40:12 PM »
I'm not sure what we're comparing, as it's two different guns.
John Robbins

Offline blienemann

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Re: Oerter rifle
« Reply #11 on: November 03, 2020, 01:17:57 AM »
Yes, a Halloween prank, could not wait for next April 1st.  Eric is the master of confusing old and new work, so I asked him to post this short narrative and the pics.  But he was not supposed to label the post as Oerter, as I wanted readers to think a bit!  And I wanted to take a shot at the experts on this site who advise builders to use German locks on PA rifles and English locks on southern work, as that clearly did not hold true for Oerter or other early makers.

This is the Oerter rifle made in 1774 for Aaron Hankinson of the New Jersey militia, and shown in Moravian Gunmaking II.  I was fortunate to handle this rifle and others, and study via photos several not physically available.  The family who owned this rifle asked me if they should have the old rifle cleaned up, and I advised them to leave it just as is.  Better to make a new copy of an old rifle, than to mess with the old one, in my view.

So I stocked up this rifle several years ago.  I used the Davis German styled lock, which good friend Jack Brooks made the patterns for (though subsequent production changed the bolster and internals!).  A recent health issue slowed me down, and Jack helped to complete the rifle.  I carefully copied the wire inlay from the original, stained the stock, while Jack did the remaining physical work, engraving and finish.

Redheart, the new rifle may not have the same look, but it is copied as closely as we are capable of doing.  Other than the lock, and angle of buttplate which really changes the appearance, this rifle is very close to the original.  From our careful study, the old rifles appear to have a butterscotch color in the wood from nitric, and a shiny built up varnish finish on top of the wood, with red in that finish.  On the old rifles where the finish is worn away, the red is worn away, leaving the nitric.  It is very difficult to photograph the new rifle, and good friend Mtn Meek took the crisp new photos.  But the shiny varnish finish, silver star and bright lock and barrel cause the wood to look dark, and hide the fine curl.  Viewed in sunlight, the color and curly maple show, along with the decoration.  Imagine Major Hankinson standing with his troops, holding this rifle.  He fought at Brandywine and Germantown, but for many years he and his militia were stationed along the Delaware, fighting the Native Americans in hit and run fashion, where a rifle would be desirable.

Moderators - this should probably go over to Contemporary Building, but I also wanted this chance to show poor photos of the old rifle, and to discuss how this 1774 rifle must have looked when 27 year old Christian Oerter handed it off to Hankinson.  I found this whole project to be educational.  We tend to prefer the old or aged look, but a rifle like this would have been quite a calling card, back in the day.

Please don't give Eric too much grief, and Jack and Mtn Meek were not aware of this post.  Respectfully and with apology, Bob

Offline redheart

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Re: Oerter rifle
« Reply #12 on: November 03, 2020, 01:33:37 AM »
I apologize Bob.
No offence meant.  :)

Offline Dennis Glazener

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Re: Oerter rifle
« Reply #13 on: November 03, 2020, 03:01:03 AM »
Quote
Please don't give Eric too much grief, 

Oh Bob, you know Eric deserves it :)
Dennis
"I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend" - Thomas Jefferson

Offline blienemann

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Re: Oerter rifle
« Reply #14 on: November 03, 2020, 03:51:07 AM »
Redheart, no offense taken, thanks.  It is truly jarring !! to see a new made version of this old rifle.  I would love to display the old and new together (on a table vs. in this post), and I think this approach of stocking a new twin is generally better than trying to clean up an old rifle.  At some point, the stock was scraped with a bladed instrument which left a few scratches in the wood, and then the entire rifle was shellacked.  Some of the shellac has bubbled or wrinkled, and some areas of the silver and brass have seen air, so they are colored differently.  IF one removed the shellac, then the wood, silver and brass would have blotchy variations in color, so would that then have to be evened out?  Then some finish applied again to the scraped stock?  It is hard to know when to stop - so when asked, I suggested the owners keep it as is.  A future owner can always reach their own decisions, but I appreciate the rifle as it is. 

Original flint is pretty special, and Oerter and crew apparently copied the engraving from the lock's tail onto the patchbox cover.  The forestock on this rifle is spliced - overlapped carefully, but no need to throw away a good, but short piece of curly maple.  Cut a section from above or below the forestock, and the wood matches just fine.  Fast twist in the barrel, maybe around 1:35 or so, which is common with others, including #42.  The lock and lower buttstock mouldings are in brass wire - quite a bit of which has fallen out, while all the other designs are in silver - which seems to remain in the stock more readily. 

I've often heard of brass on a rifle called "a poor man's gold".  Filed smooth and burnished, it does look like gold, and the silver is so striking in contrast to the dark stock that it looks like platinum, or white ink painted on the stock.  After just a little use and carry in the field, i suppose this all would mellow.  Jack would rather have mellowed the look, but that was not the intent this time.  Did the owner of such a rifle allow it to mellow, or did they rub and polish to keep bright?  We see finish worn away around the inlays on these old rifles - but was that constant over time, or recent work?

The bright brass and silver really interrupt the stock profile, and make it look completely different, even though the two rifles are very similar. 

I conclude from study of the Christian's Spring gunshop inventories that Oerter pulled a manufactured / imported lock from the supply to stock most rifles.  There are several mentions of one lock made in the shop when Albrecht was teaching young Oerter, but none later.  So changing to an equally popular German styled lock did not concern me, as it was Oerter's and boys' stocking and design that I was curious to replicate.

Thank you for putting up with this post.  We sometimes do see someone post an old rifle that they plan to "restore", and we hope they know enough to do a good job.  Or leave it as is for study.  Bob