Stock carving question:

[Wingshot]

A recent thread pertaining to stock carving practice wood from a beginner (who really displayed some talent!) has me questioning my ability to ever learn how to carve even the most basic of patterns.
The question I have for those of you that are skillful at it is this, does a person have to be able to draw well in order to get the outline and detail onto the wood or are there improvised ways to copy and transfer a design onto the stock wood or practice piece? I am sure that with practice and the right tools I could follow drawn lines but I seriously doubt I could just draw the lines freehand as I see so many do. As always, thanks for the help.

[J. Talbert]

There are ways to transfer patterns to wood but not without drawbacks.  One big one being the three dimensional nature of a gun stock.
When I first started trying to draw my patterns onto the wood I thought I would never master it, but believe it or not the more I did the easier it got. I suggest you find a basic pattern or two off of an original and practice duplicating it on paper.

Good luck
Jeff

[Tom Currie]

In most areas you can use simple carbon paper to transfer a drawing that you've made on paper. You still have to be able to draw well. Even if some detail doesn't transfer you can get 90% of the drawing transferred and fill in the blanks.

[TommyG]

Jeff is 100% correct in his reply above. And you will need a good design/ drawing to follow when carving (unless maybe you carved a few dozen guns).   I too struggle with freehand drawing, but after much practice have gotten better.  I know what works for me, and you will find what works best for you.  I do some transfer of designs to basically get a head start and set the parameters or borders of the design.  From there it's pencil/eraser until I'm satisfied.  I like to use a 6B pencil, they seem to work best for drawing on stock wood.  Also, as a rule (for me), I never carve until I "digest" the design for a few days.  I'll take pics of the design and look at them as well.  I always end up coming back and making small tweaks and changes.  One last thing, for your first few guns, don't go overboard unless you are confident in your skills.  Try to keep things a bit on the simpler side and progress from there. Good luck carving.

[mgbruch]

If that's what you want, then I would say to practice... a lot... until you feel your work is good enough for a gun.  But a gun doesn't require carving to be a beautiful work of art.

[Dwshotwell]

I have never been able to draw, and almost failed Jr. High art class because I refused to try. This winter, I broke my leg pretty bad and am just now getting into the shop. I filled the time by practicing my drawing and I made WAY more progress than I ever thought I would, to the point where I have been able to draw out and carve.

I did three things: I did a basic online drawing class that helped me learn how to break things down to shapes (rectangles, circles, ovals, etc.) and then add details. Simple things to those with an artistic aptitude, but for me it was like a lightbulb went on. I don’t remember the name off hand but can dig up the link if you’re interested.

I bought the scroll templates from Rio Grande that were recommended on this forum. They provide basic shapes and proportions to draw leaves and scrolls as are common in long rifle carving. These really helped me get over the hump.

The third thing I did, after practicing the above, was take a sketch book and my copy of Moravian Gunbuilding, and try to replicate on paper the work I was seeing on guns I liked. Since then I’ve started doing the same with RCA 1. Just little bits of detail here and there that I like. I’m by no means perfect at it, but I have been AMAZED at the progress I’ve made.

A year ago I was thinking I’d have to transfer drawings from other sources in order to carve anything. Now I am confident I can do at least some basic stuff. Also, having another aspect of the hobby - drawing the sketches - that I can do anywhere I can take a sketch pad and a pencil, along with a book or pictures in my phone, has been great.

[Wingshot]

David, thank you for sharing that story and I would be interested in the online course you mentioned. All of the advice is good of course and I think it’s like anything else in life’s journey, you have to take the first step. I took mechanical drawing in high school and remember how to use French curves, etc. I’m just going to have to set the time aside to literally put pencil to paper and see where it takes me.

[smylee grouch]

Some people take a bunch of scrap paper and practice drawing those scrolls ( doodling ) whenever they get a free 30 seconds. After a while the scrolls get better with less dog legs and you can work in vines and leaves etc. Then you can figure out how to fit it into your area. this will help you with your own design or one you want to copy.

[Dwshotwell]

Here’s a link to  the drawing class. I really only did the first set of lessons.
https://drawpj.com/codc-v3/

Here’s a link to the scroll master templates. They were recommended by someone else on this forum but I can’t remember who it was:
https://www.riogrande.com/product/scrollmaster-kit/118136GP/?code=118136

The main thing has just been practice and lots of erasing.

[c deperro]

A person needs to erase well. Spend an hour a night drawing the carving of rifles in a book . You draw . You compare it to the picture. And you ERASE what does not look correct. then you redraw and erase . Over and over and over and over until you get it right. If you do that for a few weeks your drawing should show big improvements. You will not get good carving if the drawing is bad. Practice practice practice is the name of the game. Personally a plain gun looks a whole lot better to me than a nice gun that a gun person carved poorly.

[Jerry V Lape]

The drawback of making a copy and transferring it to the stock is that the original and new stock are seldom ever identical especially between the cheek piece and the butt.  So re-scaling is required.   I sketch it on the new stock and make adjustments repeatedly until it is correct to my eye.  Second thing is before I ever carve the new stock I practice that same carving on a practice stock.  If I can't fully visualize the depths and relationships on the practice stock it won't be right on the new stock.  Some of the carvings are pretty intricate on creating illusion of multiple depths and I can determine which tools I will need to do this carving best.  Recently I carved and re-carved a tang pattern 5 times before I figured out how to approach it so It was nice. Then I carved it on the new stock.

[Wingshot]

A lot to take in apparently. I bookmarked the link for the drawing course and I have some patterns to work off of. Sketch book and some time every evening seems to be something I could manage. I’m so glad I posted this topic, you all are a huge help!

[Chowmi]

Everything said above about practice practice practice is correct.  There is another element to it.  You must look and study the designs of the old master’s carving.  Those of us who are not artistically inclined (me definitely included), fail to see the flowing lines and what makes a good design unless we work very hard at it.  Attempt to copy a carving design you like, and when you think you have done a good job, set it aside for 24 hours.  Go back and compare the two and you will find lots of errors (I suspect).  Be super critical of your attempts, that is the only way to get better. 
I’m not a good artist, and never have been.  It takes me days or weeks to execute a design, with constant tweaking to make it better.  I have watched some of our current master’s of the craft sketch out a beautiful pattern in no-time.   But that is the result of study and practice. 
What I’m trying to say is that you can do it, but you must look closely and be critical of your work.  That is the path to getting better.

Cheers,
Norm

[Wingshot]

I’ve tied flies for years, not just trout patterns but also saltwater, warm water predator, carp flies, etc. I’ve taught others as well and I definitely see the reoccurring theme here as it relates to stepping back to re-examine the work. That said, I guess I do possess the ability to progress thoughtfully through difficult (for me) processes. I just came in from about an hour of doodling C-Scrolls and incised lines and although they’re not acceptable copies of what I was referencing I did manage to get a good feel for it. This is practice I’ll continue to work on and when I’m a little more comfortable doing so, I’ll post some drawings for critique.