I have this old barrel...

[g.pennell]

Gentlemen,

My good friend and partner in crime Brad has recently gifted me with an old, swamped rifle barrel that I am planning to resurrect.  It is a full 48" long, 1" at the breech, tapers to .875" at the waist, and then flares to .940" at the muzzle, and is approximately .36 caliber, 7-groove, round bottom rifling.  It is a flint barrel, never converted to percussion.  the only marks we can find are the capital letters "EB" stamped into the top flat, between the breech and front sight.  An old collector told him it could have been Elisha (or Elijah) Bull, who was supposed to have had a gunshop near Bull's Gap, Tennessee.

I have to gin up an extra-long cleaning rod and scrub out the bore to see what I have to work with...also have to make a new breechplug and line the vent, and proof it before I go to too much trouble (I know, it's easier to just buy a new barrel, but...)

Anyway, I'm casting about for rifle style that might be appropriate to an extra length barrel...in other words, what would you guys do?  I have a couple of ideas, but I'll hold on to them for now <grin>.

Thanks,

Greg

[eagle24]

Well, if you even THINK the EB was Elisha Bull (whether it was or not), then IMO the only rational, sensible, level headed, non ignorant, brilliant, etc......thing to do would be build some sort of iron mounted southern rifle!

[Dr. Tim-Boone]

The ultimate squirrel rifle!!!

[flintriflesmith]

Obviously you can do as you please but, with the initials, rear sight and muzzle decoration surviving so well, I think it would be a real shame to reuse this antique artifact. It is a collector's item and while there isn't a lot of $$ value it does have meaning and historical value as an artifact. If those same stamps do show up on any examples of Bull's work as TN rifle collector would love to have this barrel to go with his rifle.

I began building rifles when reusing old barrels was the normal and accepted thing to do. Now I wonder how many signatures by otherwise unknown or undocumented period gunsmiths we simply filed away so a new rifle could be made.

Gary

[Ben I. Voss]

My vote would echo flintriflesmith's sentiments. Neat find.

[Majorjoel]

From my own experience, I have restocked 6 old barrels into flintlock rifles. Although I did enjoy the experience of shooting them (probably for the first time in 100+ years) and learned a lot just from building them.  One of the things I learned is an old barrel is always a liability! Today we have the privilage to choose from so many QUALITY new barrels. You can get pretty much anything in the style and profile as the originals made with modern steel. Using an old barrel, you will spend the same amount of time and close to the same amount of money. When finished, what have you got? Did I mention accuracy! It may shoot but will not hold a candle on the line with your buddies CVA or his TC. When you try to sell it, you will be very lucky to get back the $$ you paid for parts.

[Dr. Tim-Boone]

Can't argue with the liability issue, nor the historical value.  It might be fun to build a bull rifle with a copy of the original barrel and display the replica rifle along with the original barrel. A memorial if you will, for Bull.

[The other DWS]

I have really mixed feelings on this general issue.

However in this specific case since it is a signed, or at least an initialed, barrel, possibly from a little known maker I'd come down on the side of conserving it carefully and preserving it.   I wonder if, even after cleaning, it would be shootable without a complete refreshing o the bore.   then there is the issue of metallurgy/liability.  .  .  .  .  .

Now if it were a totally unmarked barrel in better condition and it I had a way to check it for structural flaws  I might consider it.  I think one can make qualitative judgements in favor of reuse, for interpretation and education, of relatively available, common or generic historical artifacts.  Obviously it requires some careful thought and consultation before doing so, but I would not automatically rule it out.

[Trkdriver99]

I have a barrel of about the same size and age. There is no initial or signature on it. Mine is 42 1/2 inches long, swamped and a .36 caliber. It is with Bobby Hoyt now. It has original sights, front needs work and original mounts. Bobby says it needs boring. I will have a rifle made out of it when it is finished. Not sure but probably an early Va style with iron furniture. I have a curley maple piece of wood and a walnut piece, don't know which to use. But I do wish to have a musket made from it.

Ronnie

[rich pierce]

They sure made them heavy back in the day!  Terrific find.

[g.pennell]

Lots of food for thought, thanks for all the replies.

I did some searching on line, but can find no pictures of an Elisha Bull rifle...only some genealogy pages that list an Elisha Bull as a gunsmith in Tennessee, and a vague reference in an old Muzzle Blasts article to "caplock rifles as built by Elisha Bull". 

As commonly as rifle parts have been reused throughout history, I hadn't really given much thought to this barrel having any special significance...just an old dis-associated barrel from a junk pile at a small town gunshow.  Heck, from reading some of Peter Alexander's comments in Gunsmith of Grenville Co. I thought it was STILL common practice!

I would like to know more about the possible maker, if anyone has any information, or can refer me to a collector knowledgeable in Tennessee rifles.

Greg

[eagle24]

Greg,
Jerrry Nobles books have several pictures of Elisha Bull rifles.  Very slender, very good architecture.  Gary (Flintriflesmith) is probably giving you good advice to save the barrel as an historic artifact.  You could get one made to the specs of your barrel for not too much.  I know Ed Rayl will do it for a reasonable price.  After thinking about your post some, that will make a pretty heavy rifle.  I don't know what you intend to do with whatever you decide to build, but it might be less than a joy to carry if you were going to hunt skwerls with it.

[smylee grouch]

Great find. I too have an old one but it came with all the other parts (rifle was complete) so i had Jim Goodoien fresh it out and it shoots great. It is 1and 3/16 across the flats so had plenty of thickness to work with, Something you will have to consider if you have it recut.      Wished my workbench was that clean.   Gary

[jwh1947]

For a shooter, a modern steel barrel has more integrity.  Also, if you build it up, it is likely only a matter of time until the gun is misrepresented to be something it isn't, again adding confusion to people who study them.

[Clowdis]

Many years ago we had one come through the door of the shop and we traded a pound of powder for it. It was a hand forged barrel that was in fairly good shape about 1 inch at the breech tapering to 7/8 at the waist and back to 15/16 at the end and 44 inches overall. I had a friend fresh it out to a little over 40 caliber and I stocked it with a maple "poor boy" style stock just to see what it would do. It shot fairly well but wasn't really what I'd call a match winning barrel. It wasn't really a historically significant barrel either since it wasn't signed and couldn't be contributed to any particular maker. In retrospect I think it would have been better if I had had the barrel lined or rebored to maybe 50 caliber or so and made it into a better shooter. I didn't really save a piece of history nor did I make a really good shooter out of it, sort of half ar$$ed it if you know what I mean. So, choose one way or the other and do a good job of it and don't leave it half done, you'll be much happier with yourself.