Author Topic: Reworked Tang...AAARRRRGGGHHH (Read 9002 times)

LURCHWV@BJS · « **on:** March 28, 2010, 03:04:52 AM »

Well I tried and think I failed. Here are before and after pics of the tang. I think I need to just buy another breechplug but I don't know the maker of the barrel. No markings no name. I took pics of the threads and dia. Maybe someone could tell me what to look for.

Having trouble resizing on Photobucket...SORRY

RICH

Ken G · « **Reply #1 on:** March 28, 2010, 03:22:09 AM »

Rich,
What did you do to the tang? Did you reshape it? Heat or cold forging it? What size barrel and caliber is your barrel.
Ken

LURCHWV@BJS · « **Reply #2 on:** March 28, 2010, 03:30:57 AM »

Cut,filed,heated, beat,forged, welded then filed some more a little too much.I say. Cal .54 One inch across. A one inch socket fits perfectly on it.

Rich

billd · « **Reply #3 on:** March 28, 2010, 03:31:13 AM »

Rich,
I see your from WV. Are you any where near Ed Rayle? You may be better sending the barrel out and have a breech plug fitted. I'm not trying to discourage you, but if you don't start on the right foot, you'll never finish it. There's no reason you can't make yourself a decent shooting gun with what you have, but using used parts just makes everything harder.

Bill

LURCHWV@BJS · « **Reply #4 on:** March 28, 2010, 03:35:28 AM »

Two and a half hours from Ed, On vacation soon, may take a trip.

Rich

billd · « **Reply #5 on:** March 28, 2010, 03:40:26 AM »

How far are you from Lodi, OH? Log Cabin Shop is there. They have classes too.
Bill

Captchee · « **Reply #6 on:** March 28, 2010, 05:23:35 PM »

if it were i, i would cut the tang off about 1/2 from the plug . then take a piece of 1/4 in plate .
Bevel the two parts , at the joint and then weld on a new section of the tang.
Then file and blind the weld back in a constant shape
I have done this with both O&A and wire feed so as to repair old broken tangs on original SXS’s
Once filed and polished down the joint does not show and will take an even color .

P.W.Berkuta · « **Reply #7 on:** March 28, 2010, 05:50:51 PM »

Well here goes --- Get a new plug and forget about welding the old. To find the threads on the old plug measure the diameter then take a ruler and lay it up along side the old plug and count the threads for 1/2" length of the plug then multiply it by 2 and that will give you the thread pitch (threads per inch) such as 3/4" dia. X 16 T.P.I.(threads per inch). Then go and buy a plug that matches the plug threads and barrel outside flats - fit the plug (no big deal just take your time) --- then patch up the large inlet job on the stock and inlet the new assembly again. Don't waste you time trying to make a silk purse out of a sow's ear! My two cents.

Captchee · « **Reply #8 on:** March 28, 2010, 08:52:13 PM »

am i missing something here , is there an issue with the plug itself ?
is it not already faced and fit ?
if so . IMO buying a new plug is a waste of time and money .
its not a sows ear . it just needs a new tang . it would take less then probably 15 minutes to cut it , weld it and shape it .
then your back in business . he will spend more time then that monkeying with facing an new plug . not to mention time waiting for the new plug to get in . also he doesn’t know the maker of the barrel .
Is it a US barrel or European ?. Whats the thread angle ?
We don’t know . While he can figure out the thread count and pitch . Its much harder to figure out the true angle of the die used to cut the threads ,
This is why we use matched taps and dies or set our mills to cut a specific angle .

the stock is going to have to be re inlet , no mater what .
So I would disagree here . The benefits of using the existing plug if at all possible are numerous .

LURCHWV@BJS · « **Reply #9 on:** March 28, 2010, 09:41:22 PM »

Quote from: Captchee on March 28, 2010, 08:52:13 PM

then your back in business . he will spend more time then that monkeying with facing an new plug . not to mention time waiting for the new plug to get in . also he doesn’t know the maker of the barrel .
Is it a US barrel or European ?. Whats the thread angle ?
We don’t know . While he can figure out the thread count and pitch . Its much harder to figure out the true angle of the die used to cut the threads ,
This is why we use matched taps and dies or set our mills to cut a specific angle .

the stock is going to have to be re inlet , no mater what .
So I would disagree here . The benefits of using the existing plug if at all possible are numerous .

Couldn'tagree more, Plus I really don't like to spend money when I don't need too. I love working with metal moreso than wood. I love taking something useless and making it useful, I may have said I failed too soon. Just needed to step back and regroup. I will be adding to, and filing this afternon Keep ya posted RICH

smallpatch · « **Reply #10 on:** March 29, 2010, 01:07:09 AM »

Lurch,

I understand not wanting to waste money if not needed. Fix the plug, BUT before you re-inlet it, buy a couple of books, figure out a plan of attack. Thing MUST inlet in the proper order when building a gun.

Pull the breechplug, and inlet the barrel completely, with full contact on the rear of the barrel, then reinstall your plug, and inlet it, with full contact on the rear of the barrel again, and with the rear of the recoil lug.

Sharp tools are a MUST. There is no such thing as too sharp.

Recreating the American Longrifle, and The Art of Building the Penns. Longrifle, are a MUST HAVE, before you get too far down the road.

My Friend, if you continue on the path you're on, without some direction, you are gonna HATE the building process.

Good luck.

Captchee · « **Reply #11 on:** March 29, 2010, 02:47:25 AM »

i would agree , books are NEVER a waste of money .
sound words

LURCHWV@BJS · « **Reply #12 on:** March 29, 2010, 03:26:24 AM »

I'm finally happy with it,

I am goig to order some books, But everyone give the name of the Book but not the Author, Or they give me the name of the Author but not the titles. What is the title to Chuck Dixons book? As for proceeding the only thing I' doing now is filling the gaps I made. I also have obtained several sharpenig stones and doing alot of sharpening.

Thank You for showing me the errors of the path I follow.

Rich

Tom Currie · « **Reply #13 on:** March 29, 2010, 03:40:03 AM »

The Art of Building the Pennsylvania Longrifle

http://dixonmuzzleloading.com/index.php?section=muzzleloadingshop&link=literature

Best $25 you'll ever spend if you want direction getting started

WV_Mountaineer · « **Reply #14 on:** March 29, 2010, 03:57:25 AM »

Lurch;
The main website has a section on recommended books that lists title, author, and where to purchase:
http://www.americanlongrifles.org/Books_frame.htm.

I thought I saw one of your posts on another thread that indicated you had ordered "The Gunsmiths of Grenville County". If so, I would like to know where you found it, everywhere I look is out of print.

Thanks,
Steve

Corrected based on Dennis Glazener's comments. My apology for any confusion caused.

dannybb55 · « **Reply #15 on:** March 29, 2010, 04:15:47 AM »

If it were me I would heat the tang up to bright orange and draw it out straight and parallel. If it got too long then I would do like I have seen on old tangs, double the iron on itself and forge weld it, aka fagot weld it. With that it will be short and thick. Just make sure that you keep the barrel cool. It's no harder than welding reins on tongs. We need to start thinking more like smiths and less like carpenters or eisenhowers.
Danny

smallpatch · « **Reply #16 on:** March 29, 2010, 05:46:05 AM »

The Art of Building the Pennsylvania Rifle is by Chuck Dixon. Available almost anywhere. TOTW , Dixon's, MLS, etc.

Recreating the American Longrifle by William Buchelle, Shumway Publishing.... I think the same places.

Plan your work..... Work your plan.

Get all your materials together first, install them in the right order.

Good luck.

LURCHWV@BJS · « **Reply #17 on:** March 29, 2010, 08:59:27 AM »

WV_MOUNT,

Dixie Gun Works has it, I just havent ordered it yet. For th rest Thanx for the info.

Rich

Dennis Glazener · « **Reply #18 on:** March 30, 2010, 02:55:08 AM »

Quote

The old website has a section on recommended books that lists title, author, and where to purchase:
http://www.americanlongrifles.org/Books_frame.htm.

Wanted to make a correction here. That link is NOT the old website, I moved everything from the old website to a new host and installed new software for this forum. www.americanlongrifles.org is the home page for ALR. http://www.americanlongrifles.org/Books_frame.htm is a page on the ALR website just like http://www.americanlongrifles.org/forum takes you to the forum page. Most folks bypass the home page ( http://www.americanlongrifles.org ) and go directly to the forum.

Just a FYI.
Dennis

LURCHWV@BJS · « **Reply #19 on:** March 30, 2010, 04:24:57 AM »

Thank You Mr Glazener.

Rich

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Author Topic: Reworked Tang...AAARRRRGGGHHH (Read 9002 times)

LURCHWV@BJS

LURCHWV@BJS

billd

LURCHWV@BJS

billd

LURCHWV@BJS

LURCHWV@BJS

WV_Mountaineer

dannybb55

LURCHWV@BJS

LURCHWV@BJS