Author Topic: Pea Picker  (Read 17047 times)

keweenaw

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Pea Picker
« on: April 30, 2010, 05:41:18 PM »
I've long admired the George Schreyer Pea Picker rifle so decided to build a fairly close copy as a spec. piece.  The only thing I don't like about the original Pea Picker is the patch box, not one of George's better efforts, so I took one from another of his rifles that would work in the same space.  The guard is one of Drew Hedgecock's Beck guards reshaped to the design of the original Schreyer, PB is from Reeves Goering.  The barrel is a 44" B weight 50 cal from Rice and the lock is a deluxe Siler from Chambers.  I made all the other mounts from sheet brass and forged the trigger from some 1/16 sheet steel.  Barrel was browned - color shows up in the picture of the tang carving, lock was color case hardened and most of the colors rubbed off with some 600 grit lapping compound.  Stock was stained with my home made AF and finished with Chamber's oil.  This one came out less red than usual.  The only thing I didn't do was the engraving on the patch box.  That was graciously done for me by Mark Silver.  He cut it very close to the engraving on the original from which it was copied with the omission of the wrigglework shading that Schreyer used on his major lines. The patch box catch is a spring riveted through the butt plate like Schreyer did.   Rifle weights about 7 lb. 12 0z.  The patch box was very hard to get a decent photo of, it looks much better in person.










« Last Edit: April 30, 2010, 06:50:54 PM by snyder »

Offline rich pierce

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Re: Pea Picker
« Reply #1 on: April 30, 2010, 05:56:07 PM »
I've always admired that gun, too, and Schroyer's creativity.  Nice work!
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Offline Nate McKenzie

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Re: Pea Picker
« Reply #2 on: April 30, 2010, 06:15:15 PM »
I love it.

Offline Ky-Flinter

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Re: Pea Picker
« Reply #3 on: April 30, 2010, 06:19:17 PM »
Well done, Snyder!  Very nice indeed.  The little bevel on the side plate panel edge just knocks me out.  I'm going to remember that detail for future.

How about a few more pictures.  I'd love to see the transition at the breech.  Do you have a shot just a little forward of your tang carving photo?  And maybe a full length shot?  Thanks.

-Ron
« Last Edit: April 30, 2010, 06:20:26 PM by KyFlinter »
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Offline Dr. Tim-Boone

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Re: Pea Picker
« Reply #4 on: April 30, 2010, 07:32:54 PM »
A joy to the eyes!! I like your copy work.  So you say you built it on spec. What would the price be...if you were going to sell it.... ;D
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Offline Acer Saccharum

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Re: Pea Picker
« Reply #5 on: April 30, 2010, 08:34:40 PM »
Cool beans! I mean, peas! Sweet rendition, very nicely done.

Tom
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Online Habu

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Re: Pea Picker
« Reply #6 on: April 30, 2010, 08:44:29 PM »
Nicely done, Snyder!

flintman-tx

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Re: Pea Picker
« Reply #7 on: May 01, 2010, 04:48:22 AM »
Impressive!!

Offline J. Talbert

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Re: Pea Picker
« Reply #8 on: May 01, 2010, 06:11:10 AM »
Hey Tom,

Nice Lookin!

Coned from the inside, I See.  Have you shot it?  How'd it do?

Jeff

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Offline RobertS

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Re: Pea Picker
« Reply #9 on: May 01, 2010, 07:07:56 AM »
Wonderfully done, and I am sure that Schreyer would be flattered!

msw

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Re: Pea Picker
« Reply #10 on: May 01, 2010, 07:41:11 AM »
great looking rifle!   i have an unfinished stock in lacewood, and now i know what to do... thanks!

Offline B Shipman

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Re: Pea Picker
« Reply #11 on: May 01, 2010, 08:52:18 AM »
IMHO, when you're doing a specific and significant rifle like the "peapicker". you either nail it exactly or you have a chinese copy. This is not the place for interpretatuion. As a Schroyer , it's a grand rifle, but it's a mistake from the artistic standpoint. I've made the same.

Offline Ben I. Voss

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Re: Pea Picker
« Reply #12 on: May 01, 2010, 03:11:27 PM »
So, Bill (Shipman), do you mean that he should have made a more exact copy? Can you be more specific?

Offline Tom Currie

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Re: Pea Picker
« Reply #13 on: May 01, 2010, 03:54:29 PM »
Nicely done Snyder. I'm a Schroyer fan also, not because of his classic artistic ability ( I think that's what Bill Shipman is reffering to ) but more so that he was creative and not afraid to carve whatever inspired him. Sure isnt classic roccoco but that's the beauty in his work. Shumways book on Schroyer examines this in detail.


Offline Mike Brooks

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Re: Pea Picker
« Reply #14 on: May 01, 2010, 05:06:29 PM »
IMHO, when you're doing a specific and significant rifle like the "peapicker". you either nail it exactly or you have a chinese copy. This is not the place for interpretatuion. As a Schroyer , it's a grand rifle, but it's a mistake from the artistic standpoint. I've made the same.
Very interesting Bill. I'd love to hear you expand on your thoughts in this area...

Nice gun Snyder, I've always been a big fan of the pea picker... I'd like to do a rough copy someday too.
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Offline Cory Joe Stewart

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Re: Pea Picker
« Reply #15 on: May 01, 2010, 06:01:05 PM »
Very very cool.
I am amazed how perfectly the barrel wedges are in there.

Coryjoe

Offline D. Taylor Sapergia

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Re: Pea Picker
« Reply #16 on: May 01, 2010, 07:04:17 PM »
I really like your rifle too.  The cheek piece side carving is very neatly done.
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Offline Dr. Tim-Boone

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Re: Pea Picker
« Reply #17 on: May 02, 2010, 05:12:50 PM »
Very very cool.
I am amazed how perfectly the barrel wedges are in there.

Coryjoe

Yeah I am just starting to do that... I pray they come close to looking like yours Tom!!
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Offline bama

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Re: Pea Picker
« Reply #18 on: May 03, 2010, 04:41:19 AM »
Very nice rifle. I have always liked this rifle myself but then there are not many Schreyer's I don't like. I an trying to do this release on a rifle I am building now. Did you have any trouble with the spring attached to the butt plate? What did you make your spring from?
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Offline B Shipman

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Re: Pea Picker
« Reply #19 on: May 03, 2010, 08:01:42 AM »
Snyder and Mike, I'm saying this from the standpoint of recognizing that this is a really nice rifle. But, the carving on the Peapicker is unique. This is simply not the place for interpretation. I would not do this rifle unless I literally had it in hand. Schroyer varied his work, so there's lots of room for for interpretation using his style. This just isn't it. You've got to get as close as you can. You can't pick you're favorite Schroyer details and put them into one credible rifle anymore than you you can pick your favorite things from different schools and make a credible rifle. I've done the same thing.
Mike, as an example, some of your work relates to a specific and famous rifle, but represents a believeable variation, usually simpler, and works. Marks Silver's pic of a variation on a well known rifle on the cover of the CLA mag is more complex and completely believeable. A masterpiece. A sense of what works.

Offline Mike Brooks

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Re: Pea Picker
« Reply #20 on: May 03, 2010, 01:56:27 PM »
Interesting Bill, and well thought out.
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keweenaw

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Re: Pea Picker
« Reply #21 on: May 03, 2010, 04:44:35 PM »
I knew when I started this rifle that I would get some comments like Bill's and thought about that a great deal.  There are some people who don't like the original at all, too much departure from the classical rococo.   But stop by our booth at Friendship in June and see what you think in person.

While I would have loved to have the original rifle in hand, that obviously wasn't an option and as you know the original gun was highly damaged with the carving destroyed in front of the cheek piece, lots of chips in the butt and the forestock carving heavily worn.   If you compare my carving of the bird with photos of the original there are some very, tiny deviations but if this was photographed in black and white and printed with old printing technology they would look nearly identical, sans the chips, and the change in the lower volute.  The carving in front of the cheek piece is from another Shreyer rifle, mainly because that carving was destroyed on the original and while what Rudy Bahr did when he restored is patterned after other Schreyer designs, it isn't executed like the carving on any original Schreyer.  One has no real idea of what Schreyer did there.  How does one exactly copy what one doesn't know?

The one big deviation is the patch box.  Quite frankly the finial on the PB of the original Pea Picker is just plain ugly.  Obviously if one is building a commissioned copy, one duplicates the ugly PB.  I was building a rifle that I hope someone will want to buy at a fairly reasonable price.  Good look patch box trumps ugly in that context.  I spent quite a few hours (understatement) deciding which Schreyer box to use as the PB had to work with the right side wrist carving which if from the original rifle.  

Mark Silver and I talked quite a bit about whether to put the wriggle work shading lines on the engraving.  Schreyer used them extensively but we opted not to add them.  On the originals that light wriggle work has two hundred plus years of polishing and wear to tone it down so that on many of his rifles it is hardly noticeable.  You can just barely make it out in Shumway's photos of this box, but new and clean cut it would have been pretty glaring.  Second guessing, maybe.

It's interesting that Bill should mention Mark's piece on the cover of the CLA mag.  What most of you won't realize is that Mark's piece there is a pistol compared to the Faber rifle.  Mark used that same basic design on a recent rifle which many of you have seen at a CLA show a couple years ago.  That piece is really over the top where Mark has combined silver and brass wire work with high relief carving, not something for the faint of heart to attempt.  

The PB lid catch is done exactly like the riveted one that is in the photo in Shumway's Schreyer book.   I forged the spring from an annealed cut masonry nail.  After you forge it out it tends to be pretty springy so I didn't reharden and temper it.  I works great.  Cutting the little rectangular hole through the back of the BP to rivet it in is a hoot, but not all that bad.  I cut the hole with a slight taper to the outside so that the riveting in is very secure. The spring has little shoulders to the left and right of the hole to butt against the inside of the BP.  Adjusting the two opposing hooks so the lid latches securely with no play took quite a bit of time.

Haven't shot it yet.
Tom
« Last Edit: May 03, 2010, 05:03:00 PM by snyder »

Offline Roger Fisher

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Re: Pea Picker
« Reply #22 on: May 03, 2010, 05:10:53 PM »
I'm not nearly informed on the Schroyer or whatever and certainly no engraver.  I do wonder if you are planning just a bit of your fine engraving on that box lid and the sideplate?.  Would add much more class to my eye at least......

keweenaw

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Re: Pea Picker
« Reply #23 on: May 03, 2010, 06:47:36 PM »
Roger,

While little Schreyer did was "typical" apart from his very conservative basic architecture, his PB lids are frequently cut like this one with no central element.  The original Pea Picker has a pole axe as a central element but that really doesn't work with the rotational daisy finial and one could get into endless speculation about the symbolism of the pole axe with the heart piercing in the finial on the original.  While I've followed the profile very closely on the side plate the original had a wriggle work border but most of his side plates were plain like this one.  Of course if someone wanted it done.......

Tom

Offline Darrin McDonal

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Re: Pea Picker
« Reply #24 on: May 04, 2010, 12:41:47 AM »
Very nice Snyder!!! I believe George Schroyer must have been a very interesting man. Heck, any one of the prolific builders from that era for that sake. It would be interesting to hear his point of view on his patch box designs. Why did he incorporate such diversity on the patch boxes and not the carving?
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