I've been using Bore Butter for years, but...

[flintlock]

I read the following comment from Daryl in another post:

"I don't use bore butter or other chap-stick-type lubes, which I'm told will accumulate in the corners of the rifling ..."

I can't say Bore Butter is the the best thing since sliced bread. Despite the advertisement of shooting 1000 shots with no cleaning, I can't get anywhere near that kind of result. On some days, it gets down right hard to load the next shot, especially when using hunting loads and patches that aren't freshly lubed.

I know the spit patch works well at the range, but what do you guys use in the field? 

I typically load 6 balls in a loading block the night before. My lube must be something that won't dry out. 

Thanks

[LynnC]

Crico has done fine for me and Cheap Too!...........Lynn

[david50]

mink oil from TOW
http://www.trackofthewolf.com/Categories/PartList.aspx?catID=5&subID=64&styleID=216

[LynnC]

Crisco (sp)
Can't fix it on a darn blackberry

[flintlock]

How does Crisco perform in cold weather? Does it get hard?

[Daryl]

For cold weather, I use mink oil from Track, or neetsfoot oil. They both allow multiple shots - up to at least 20 without wiping with heavy loads, and using normal target loads under 100gr., unlimited shooting - especially in the .32 and .40.  I found them to load no differently than windshielf washer fluid and soap, ie: easy, all day using mink or neetsfoot oil on a trail walk - up to 60 or 80 shots.

One of the cast bullet shooters over on another forum, who is a noted cast bullet accuracy shooter, picked up a TC Renegade in .54.  He reported it shot fairly well at 25 yards, but lost that accuracy in 15 rounds shooting bore butter as a patch lube.

He scoped the bore and found a buildup of something greasy in the corners of the groove and land, which required his normal nitro solvents to disolve.  Accuracy returned - to fail again in accuracy in another 15 shots.  He was wondering if everyone had this problem. We got him changed over to a better lube, recrowned and thicker patches, now he's happy- a new BP shooter who doesn't have to wipe while shooting- all day and whose accuracy remains good, all day.

[flintlock]

Someone above mentioned bear oil. I actually have a small jar of bear grease, won at a blanket shoot years ago. I've never used it. It still smells good... in fact it really doesn't smell at all. I kind of wondered if it would go rancid with old age. Maybe I'll give it a try. I'm headed to New Brunswick in May to try to shoot another bear with my flintlock. How fitting to shoot a bear with a PRB using bear grease as the lube.

Flintlock

[flintlock]

So tell me more about the windshield washer fluid and soap. What kind of soap? What proportions? I suppose this is a liquid that you dip your patch into or dribble on your patch? I guess you could saturate a bunch of patches in a plastic container and shoot from the container. 

[LynnC]

Cold is a relative thing - Hrer in the deep south, 25 is COLD.  I soak, drain, cool and store in a tin.  They'll load OK for several shots.

I've never tried the mink or neetsfoot as the crisco was in the cabinet so I can't claim the crisco is any better.  Try em all and see what works for you.........Lynn

[doulos]

TOTW mink oil has been working for me for hunting here in the cold of western ny.  I use diluted ballistol about 6 or 7 to 1 at the range.

[Daryl]

Most of us up here are suing soem form of windshield washer fluid (-35 to -40 still) with a few squirts of liquid soap, or neetsfoot oil, or olive oil in it - perhaps an ounce of iol in 12 oz. of fluid.  Shake well, then saturate the pre-cuts in a metal tin, like a sucrets tin with the outside paint burnt off.

Mixed with oil, it will separate, but not if shaken then applied ot the mes of patches you will be using that day. This is only for target shooting. For hunting, an oil or grease of some sort is needed.

Spit works as well as anything else for target shooting - either saturated in a pre-cut or strip of cloth cut at the muzzle - MUST use enough lube.

[northmn]

For a hunting rifle where one shot may be all that's needed in deer season, Crisco, Bore Butter or about anything of that nature will work.  Two purposes lube has are the ability to control the nature of fouling and to protect the bore.  A hunting lube where the rifle may be carried with the same load (depending upon your personal philosophy) should be of a grease nature as it also may prevent rusting when loading.  Personally I think that is what the old tallow lubes did as GGGranddad kept the same load in his rifle for some time. For cold weather I just bought some cold weather udder balm from a farm supply store, which is about 1/3 the price of Bore Butter but contains lanolin and other interesting ingredients that should work.  I am anxious to try it in my squirrel rifle.
For target shooting you are controlling the nature of the lube and a cleaning solvent of some nature seems to work about as good as anything for continuous shooting.  In these instances you load and shoot afterwards very quickly.  These lubes can dry out and be worthless for extended carry, but permit a lot of shooting between cleaning.
The biggest education on lubes for me came with shooting a single shot 45-70 with BP.  some of the "miracle" lubes suggested for patch lubes did not work at all (such as carburetor cleaner for cleaning).  In a long barreled cartridge gun the fouling would occur at the last few inches of the bore and accuracy went to H--l in a hand basket.  Lubes like SPG and Lyman Gold as well as a few homemades were needed for bullets and can be adapted for patches.   

DP

[beleg2]

Hi,
Thanks for the info.
I would like to try bear oil but could not import it because custom laws.
I will order some mink oil soon.

As most "cold weather udder balm" is mostly petrolatum,
what about using vaseline (petrolatum) as patch lube?

Thanks
Martin

[Daryl]

Vaseline works as a bullet lube in BP guns - about 60% beeswax, 40% Vaseline.  I've tried olive oil instead of Vaseline, but it wasn't as accurate.
For patches, the mink oil does work well and allows enough shots for hunting, even small game shooting. I've left the 14 bore loaded for 3 months, and hit centre on a 100 meter target when discharging it, finally.  Neetsfoot oil does not evapourate either.  I've used patches that were lubed and stored in a non-air-tight container for 6 or 7 years- the patches didn't even rot as normally happens with some other lubes.  that was a surprise.
Due to our weather up here during hunting season, we have to use a lube that won't freeze into a block-hard- bore butter does, as does any of the normal bullet lubes.  Mink oil lubed patches are still soft to the touch.

Martin - don't you have a rather fat, water rodent living in Ven.?  I can't remember the name offhand, but the fat from the interior of that animal might be just as good as marmot oil, which is one of the best here- I find better than bear's oil or grease.

[northmn]

I haven't tried the cold weather balm, but it does contain mineral oil.  May or may not work.  Crisco works fine for most of my hunting needs as does the Bore Butter.  Cirsco does build up fouling but it takes a few shots.  Also it does not sometimes to slow things down and do a little cleaning in the field.  I carry a few saturated patches with me for that purpose after a shot.

DP

[flintlock]

Martin - don't you have a rather fat, water rodent living in Ven.? 

Don't recognize where "Ven" is, but could you be thinking of a nutria?

[hanshi]

My default lube is Hoppes which allows almost unlimited shooting.  Hunting is a different story.  In the field the gun may or may not be fired and/or may be kept loaded at home for an indefinite period of time.  Even with an op wad a liquid lube COULD still contaminate the powder.  This is why my first load of the day (hunting) is a grease lube-Crisco, etc-that won't dry out or form rust.  I've never bought Bore Butter but was given a good supply by a friend several years ago.  It's all gone now so Crisco is the lube of choice.

While grease is always the first load for the field, ALL reloads are lubed with Hoppes, never grease.  Back when I lived in Georgia a cold morning was anything under 40 degrees and seldom was any morning much below freezing.  The day warmed up quickly, too.  Here in Va. it's still quite mild during hunting season.  A grease lube won't harden under these conditions.  And as soon as the powder ignites the grease is liquified, anyway.  

[bgf]

The thing that works best for me so far is vegetable oil, simply roll up a strip of pillow ticking, stick it in a pill bottle and add enough oil to saturate the roll of patching.  If it sits a few days, its even better.  Squeeze out all the excess you can.

Of course, this is for informal target use only -- probably not a good idea for hunting patch.  I always wipe between shots, just because I'm a little compulsive about consistency and think it is not a bad idea in terms of safety, but I have gone 5-10 rounds without wiping as a test and noticed no real difference in loading, even with a good, tight patch/ball combination. 

I know that this probably totally wrong, but it seems to work OK from 20 degrees F on up, at least for me. 

[beleg2]

Vaseline works as a bullet lube in BP guns - about 60% beeswax, 40% Vaseline. I've tried olive oil instead of Vaseline, but it wasn't as accurate.
For patches, the mink oil does work well and allows enough shots for hunting, even small game shooting. I've left the 14 bore loaded for 3 months, and hit centre on a 100 meter target when discharging it, finally.  Neetsfoot oil does not evapourate either.  I've used patches that were lubed and stored in a non-air-tight container for 6 or 7 years- the patches didn't even rot as normally happens with some other lubes.  that was a surprise.
Due to our weather up here during hunting season, we have to use a lube that won't freeze into a block-hard- bore butter does, as does any of the normal bullet lubes.  Mink oil lubed patches are still soft to the touch.

Martin - don't you have a rather fat, water rodent living in Ven.?  I can't remember the name offhand, but the fat from the interior of that animal might be just as good as marmot oil, which is one of the best here- I find better than bear's oil or grease.

That's Why I think liquid vaseline would work using it alone as a patch lube.


It would be very interesting to try some nutrial oil, also there are other big rodents like the vizcacha and the chinchilla. Also the biggest rodent in the word the capibara or carpincho. There are some pretty close home as they escape from a hunting ranch some year ago.  :Dd
It have to be different as mink is a very different animal (carnivore)
BTW: in USA you have also our nutrias in some place IIRC.
I should try them.
Thanks
Martin

[Leatherbelly]

 I think Bore Butter is GREAT...in my utility trailer axle  bearings.I also like to smear a little on my "handlebar" moustache when I'm in the outhouse...'cause it smells good! In a gun barrel, never in any of mine, -tried it once. The only way I could get it out was boiling hot water and we all know what boiling water and steel make. sorry, trying to be negative and funny together.

[BrownBear]

The clearest demo of Bore Butter I've seen was in a hunting bud's rifle.  He'd been using it 10+ years, following the "no pretroleum" dictates to the letter.  Cleaned only with water.  Bore was real black and he was real proud of it.

Last year it started shooting like a cheap shotgun with bad loads.  "Groups" were loose patterns.  And this guy is a very good shot.

At my insistence, rather than replace the barrel, he tried cleaning it with brake pad cleaner solution on a series of patches.  The bore came back to shiny bright, and all the "seasoning" was lost.  Broke his heart.  Until he shot it.  It's a tack driver once again. 

Did he switch from Bore Butter?  Nope.  He's stuck on it.  But he vows that once a year he's going to use brake pad cleaner.

[Daryl]

The clearest demo of Bore Butter I've seen was in a hunting bud's rifle.  He'd been using it 10+ years, following the "no pretroleum" dictates to the letter.  Cleaned only with water.  Bore was real black and he was real proud of it.

Last year it started shooting like a cheap shotgun with bad loads.  "Groups" were loose patterns.  And this guy is a very good shot.

At my insistence, rather than replace the barrel, he tried cleaning it with brake pad cleaner solution on a series of patches.  The bore came back to shiny bright, and all the "seasoning" was lost.  Broke his heart.  Until he shot it.  It's a tack driver once again. 

Did he switch from Bore Butter?  Nope.  He's stuck on it.  But he vows that once a year he's going to use brake pad cleaner.

Brownbear - Just goes to show, you can help some of the people, some of the time,  but not all of the people, all of the time.  Sometimes I guess it's best not to distract those in particular with facts.

Martin - marmots are not carnivorous, nor even omniverous yet the oil is good for patches and for water proofing boots.
 I would not use a liquid Vaseline alone as it is a petrolium derivitive, isn't it, and if so, probably will not combine with black powder fouling? Why Vaseline salve works so well as a bullet lube when mixed with beeswax, I don't know, just that it is a very good BP bullet lube.  20 consectutive non-wiped shots without wiping in a .50 ctg. gun, and maintaining 1 1/2MOA to 200 yards says it works, with no wiping - oh yeah, I already said that.
We have no Nutria here, but that's the water rodent I was referring to.

LB, easy, buddy.

[roundball]

Used Natural Lube 1000 for 18 years myself...great lube as far as I'm concerned...just can't let it build up and its one of the reasons I use steaming hot soapy water for cleaning to keep the bores at their bare, raw metal state all the time.

I think I've posted this before...the "egg residue on a breakfast plate" as an analogy to bore butter:
"Hold a breakfast plate under a cold water faucet and nothing happens to the egg residue stuck to the plate...but hold the plate under a hot water faucet and in seconds the egg residue melts and washes / slides right off the plate"

Add a couple dozen strokes with a bore brush during cleaning and bores are still like factory new.  As far as flash rust being caused by hot water in steel, just have to dry the bore immediately after the hot water rinse...then run a sloppy wet WD40 patch up and down a few times...no problems

[beleg2]

Daryl,
I know nothing about minks only read it:
"A mink is a carnivore in the family Mustelidae, native to the Northern Hemisphere. Mink are probably most famous for their distinctively sleek, soft fur, which has caused hunters to pursue mink for centuries."
Thanks
Martin

[Daryl]

Yes - mink are carnviours.  Bears are omnivours.  Marmots are herbivours.  I think as long as their oil is really slippery & mixes with Bp fouling to keep it soft, their food choices really don't matter much.