Patch Box Lid Release Mechanisms

[Majorjoel]

This is a subject that I have found to be kind of skimmed through in the building books that I have. For the most part I've mainly used the simple compression spring system without any of the fancy push button gadgets that were around during much of the "golden age" era. It is quite an interesting subject when a builders' ingenuity really puts a shine into a work that really becomes complete with just the touch of a button. Kind of a "monkey puzzle" or one of those exotic mouse traps. I was hopeing that some of the more experienced folks here would share with us Your favorite patch box release mechanisms. Of coarse pictures and diagrams would be much appreciated and very helpful. I understand the type of release rests upon the general school or original craftsman that the rifle is being built around. One of the systems I have never had the chance to check out is the knob or button that protrudes through the butt plate directly behind the lid. I can vaguely remember reading about some builder who was quite the practical joker. He made the rifle with two release buttons. One would open the lid. The other would prick your finger and draw blood. Another old master built the pb that needed a combination of twists and turns somewhere to get inside. Makes me think some rifle owners must have kept their gold nuggets in there too! Interesting stuff indeed!

[roundball]

I can vaguely remember reading about some builder who was quite the practical joker. He made the rifle with two release buttons. One would open the lid. The other would prick your finger and draw blood.

Or needed therapy...

[Swampwalker]

I like some of the hidden release buttons, and one I've always wanted to try was that used by some western Va. builders - an apparent knuckle of the patchbox was pushed reaward to open the patchbox.  The knuckle was actually the upper end of a pushrod extending underneath the upper side pane, and connecting to the catch spring. 

[deano]

Wasn't that boobie trapped catch release on a Fredrick Sell rifle?

[jwh1947]

I guess my favorite would be the one that would be correct for the gun that I am building.  I normally put a top button release on early Lancasters, a bottom hidden release on Fordney-era jobs, and a simple spring protrusion at the rear on my Lehighs.  I know why the boys in Lehigh did it their way...simplicity and cost.  There are regional parameters here, wider in some schools than others. Wayne

[Herb]

I restored a Jacob Wigle rifle (Westmoreland Co, PA, 1811-1844) for our museum here, and this is my exact copy of Jacob's patchbox, engraving and release mechanism.  Wasn't able to scan the original catch photo, but can take my butt plate off and photo mine if someone wants to see it.

  The latch is sprung by pushing on the brass in the toe line below the hinge.  That pushes a rod to push back the latch under the butt plate.
  The push plate pushes down the curved brass on the left, camming it against the curved brass on the right.
  Here I have removed the left curved brass so you see how it works.  It shouldn't take you more than 49.5 hours to adjust it so it works.  And this was my third copy!

[Jerry V Lape]

The book Gunsmiths of Grenville County shows several of the mechanisms used.  If there isn't one there you like it provides all the input a fertile mind should need to devise more. 

[Dphariss]

I can vaguely remember reading about some builder who was quite the practical joker. He made the rifle with two release buttons. One would open the lid. The other would prick your finger and draw blood.

Or needed therapy...

A friend of mine has done several of these. Both buttons have needles. Push both and the needle go down with the buttons.
Discourages people from spilling the box contents.

Dan

[Majorjoel]

Herb, I really appreciate your very good photo's and explanation of a very interesting and complex (to me) mechanism design. It must be a real corker to get the rod angle just right to make it's engagement to the spring! Your many hours of diligence sure paid off with the finished rifle. It is beautiful. Dan, do you know just how your friends double button finger picker system worked?

[Pete G.]

I can vaguely remember reading about some builder who was quite the practical joker. He made the rifle with two release buttons. One would open the lid. The other would prick your finger and draw blood. Another old master built the pb that needed a combination of twists and turns somewhere to get inside. Makes me think some rifle owners must have kept their gold nuggets in there too! Interesting stuff indeed!

It was a copy from an English snuff box. If you really want to make them mad the start messing around with their tea.

[Hoot AL]

I made a release disguished as a center screw in the toeplate. If the screw was aligned with the other screw heads it locked the lid button. Turn it 90 degrees with your thumbnail and the button depresses and releases the lid.  The whole mechanism was made from parts in my shop. No store bought parts.

Apologize the movie is crude.


Hoot AL

[Herb]

Got my scanner working.  This is the original Jacob Wigle rifle patchbox, butt plate removed.

Patch box lid open showing catch and lid lifter.

This is his latch.  It is probably about 190 years old.  I made mine from a hacksaw blade as I remember.  Works good.

[flintriflesmith]

I like some of the hidden release buttons, and one I've always wanted to try was that used by some western Va. builders - an apparent knuckle of the patchbox was pushed reaward to open the patchbox.  The knuckle was actually the upper end of a pushrod extending underneath the upper side pane, and connecting to the catch spring. 

There were used more in the Valley of Virginia than in "western Va.". If you have a copy on Muzzle Blasts from March 2003 there are 3 pictures on page ten showing details of how the hidden hinge release is made.
I used that style release on this rifle I made in 2005. There is a fake release button in the toe plate. It is spring loaded but pushing it doesn't do anything.

http://www.flintriflesmith.com/GunsSince1990/ja_rifle.htm

Gary

[Herb]

No, I made my catch not from a hacksaw blade, which is not wide enough, but from steel strapping.  This is the blue steel banding 3/4" wide that lumber is banded with.  It is .023 thick, the same as hacksaw blades, but you don't have to grind teeth off it.  It is easily shaped with a Dremel tool and a carbide disc.  You can heat it red, bend it to shape, and file it.   It is good spring material for patch boxes.

[J.D.]

I made a release disguished as a center screw in the toeplate. If the screw was aligned with the other screw heads it locked the lid button. Turn it 90 degrees with your thumbnail and the button depresses and releases the lid.  The whole mechanism was made from parts in my shop. No store bought parts.

Apologize the movie is crude.


Hoot AL

Now that is creative. Never seen anything like that before. That's a real hoot....AL.

God bless

[D. Taylor Sapergia]

This thread made me think of the neat release that Jacob Kuntz used on one of his fabulous rifles.  Although i didn't have pictures of the original, I could imagine how it functioned, so this is what I made.
The catch is an "L" shaped hook inside the rear end of the box.  It is kept in tension by a little "v" spring under the lateral part of the "L" and beneath the butt plate.  The release button comes through a hole in the upper plate, and a corresponding circle is engraved in the lower one to make the design symmetrical.  Works great.

[smylee grouch]

Boy does that look great, the latch too, being a Kuntz whacko I am in love with your rifle and latch.    Gary

[D. Taylor Sapergia]

I just found the sketch I made so I could better understand how this release button functioned.  I find if I can't draw it, I sure can't make it.

[Majorjoel]

Thanks Taylor, that picture drawing is worth a thousand words. It looks like this has a release on the aft buttplate without the push rod through the BP tang or toe plate.

[B. Hey]

Thanks for sharing, Taylor. As always, exceptional craftsmanship. Bill

[dannybb55]

That drawing sure solved my Salem rifle mystery.
                                       Danny