Your thoughts on the 32 caliber.....................

[Skychief]

Some great replies on the 45 thread.   Thought I would ask the same about the 32 caliber.    What's to like....what's to not like?    Hunting, targets, etc, etc.    Any experiences and thoughts appreciated!

[Dave K]

The biggest problem with a 32 is, if you don't have one, you need one. It is like saying what is the problem with a 22. You just have to have one to know.

[BrownBear]

The biggest problem with a 32 is, if you don't have one, you need one. It is like saying what is the problem with a 22. You just have to have one to know.

I agree!

In many ways I prefer it to my 36 for small game, but for the life of me I can't say why.  

I do find with either that it takes some "adjusting" to regulate them to match any expectations you might have after using a 22 rimfire for small game.  They hit so much harder and move so much more tissue on rabbits.  A neck shot can ruin front shoulders even with moderate velocities.  Lots of folks push their with 40 grains of 3f or even more, but in my hands that's a pretty destructive varmint load.  I've been working down the hill on my charges, and find even 20 grains a little hot for my tastes.  I'm going to work with 15 grains this summer, and suspect I'll hit paydirt right there.  My 32 has no trouble keeping up with a good quality 22 rimfire rifle for accuracy out to 50 yards with 20 grains of 3f.  We're talking groups well under an inch here.

[Skychief]

BrownBear, can you tell us what twist rate your 32 has?    Thanks!

[stubshaft]

I have to concur.  It is the muzzleloading equivalent of the .22RF.

It is just plain fun to shoot.

[BrownBear]

It's 1:48.

[northmn]

I am not going to be popular saying this, but after getting a 25 I think the 32 is too big for small game and not big enough for anything larger.  I had two or three of them and sold them.  While I won an aggregate with one, it had 75 yards as the longest range.  A 40 will not ruin any more meat on a head shot than a 32 and can be loaded up for targets for longer range shooting and possibly be better on coyotes or other larger critters.  About the only advantage a 32 may have is that they are more common as a smaller bore.  I rebarreled my last 32 to a 40 and sold the barrel to another builder.  My biggest gripe about any of the small bores is that it takes a pretty healthy powder charge to get top accuracy out of them.  Even my 25 likes about 20 grains of powder to move a 24 grain ball.  32's, even with a 48 twist like about 25 grains of 3f or a little more.  They hit about like a 22 mag hollow point.   They are fun to shoot but we are better served with the smaller calibers.  I really wish someone would look into speeding up the twists so that they would require a little less of a charge.  But I had a 32 Douglas with a 1-66 and the other in a 1-48 and really they liked about the same charges.  A possibility for eliminating some of the destruction may be to add a little tin to the ball.

DP

[Roger Fisher]

Hate to admit it; but I don't feel the need to use one....

Much like sending a boy to do a man's job

[Dave K]

No need to feel you don't need 32 or any small bore. I also very much also, like shooting c-fires. I have enough (can you REALLY have enough?)c-fires to know I really enjoy then as well. With that in mind, I can't imagine not having a 22 rimfire. I enjoy shooting, period. I feel the same way about the 32 or a 36, 38, 40, etc. I like to widen my horizons by experiencing it all. Always a matter of opinion and since we all have an opinion, I like the small bores. I know, I plink with them much more than I do with my 50cal. and bigger guns. Sure I deer hunt with the bigger bores, but for shooting practice, it is with the small bores. I treat my c-fires the same way. If I am going after big game, the appropriate c-fire gets the nod. But, for getting ready for a hunt, I will spend allot of time with the 22's just to hone my shooting skills, same as will the small bore muzzleloaders. I have had guns I don't like, but I don't own them anymore.

[northmn]

Please not I said after shooting a 25 I don't care for a 32.  Its really like comparing a 22 LR to a 22 mag, the 32 being the mag.  When I use a modern gun I find the 22 Lr all I need for any uses in that class.  I have a 17 HRM and really do not have a lot of use for it.  Had some 22 mags and use CF instead.  The 32 is a fun gun to shoot at "primitive" matches and does work for squirrels and other small game but is slightly overpowered.

DP

[Mike R]

The .32 rd ball is the equivalent for all intents and purposes to the .22LR [although it can be 'goosed' up to .22Mag vel].  The ball weighs  ~ same as the .22slug and can be fired at equal or better velociy. It is the squirrel rifle par excellence. I have owned .36 and .40 and traded them off--kept the .32. An empty .38 spec case holds ~24 gr BP. It is near perfect load for small game with the .32 rd ball. If I need to shoot bigger game I go to the .45 or above. After a lifetime of shooting .22s [from age 5, I am now nearing 66] I am impressed with what a .22 can do--the .32 can do it too...

[northmn]

As stated I have owned and sold at least 2 32's.   To get any kind of accuracy out of them they get to be loaded up to over 1500 fps and more like 1700 fps MV. A long rifle may give around 1200 fps with a conical bullet.  32's are definitely definitely not LR's but at  maybe a 22WRF.  Also the pure lead ball expands at a far greater rate than any 22.  I have also shot several squirrels with one and do not consider them better than a down loaded larger bore like a 45.  If they have any advantage it is in their lighter weight ball that may not carry as far.  My 40 loaded with about 35 grains of powder does no more damage than a 32.  My 25 is a far better small game rifle even though it also has to be loaded hot.  The 32, even with 15 grains of powder is still a pretty hot number and will disentegrate a squirrel head.  This being said, I think that they can be made into a better small game number if one could try even a 1-40 tin mix and possibly 1-30.  It does not take much to harden lead.  Were i to get a 32 now I would try that.  May try that in a 40 or try the "magnum" buckshot in my 25.  (I really do not need to buy another box as you get an awful lot of 25's in the 5 pounds of buckshot)

DP

[Dphariss]

Some great replies on the 45 thread.   Thought I would ask the same about the 32 caliber.    What's to like....what's to not like?    Hunting, targets, etc, etc.    Any experiences and thoughts appreciated!

I have not owned one in a long time but my first rifle as a 32.
Its a great caliber, hv and exceeds 22 mag in many ways, to 50 yards at least.
I have little use for a small bore any more but if I lived in the east with squirrels to hunt I would certainly own one.
The advantages of the small RB is limited range. The extreme range is far less than that of a 22 LR. Which is an advantage in many areas if hunting critters like squirrels.
As stated head shots on small game are highly recommended but that applies to all MLs. I don't eat squirrel heads anyway. Might lead to "mad squirrel disease"
I have never owned a 25 but once the ball gets so small everything gets pretty tiny and harder to handle/more fragile.
At short ranges like stalking cottontails and shooting them setting 15 grains in a 32 is good, No noise and it just pokes a hole in a rabbit.
 
The 32 is cheap to shoot as very versatile. If you want a caliber under 45 for target and small game its probably the best choice.
If you get one and don't care for it someone will certainly take it of your hands with no loss to you I am sure.

Dan

[Mike R]

As stated I have owned and sold at least 2 32's.   To get any kind of accuracy out of them they get to be loaded up to over 1500 fps and more like 1700 fps MV. A long rifle may give around 1200 fps with a conical bullet.  32's are definitely definitely not LR's but at  maybe a 22WRF.  Also the pure lead ball expands at a far greater rate than any 22.  I have also shot several squirrels with one and do not consider them better than a down loaded larger bore like a 45.  If they have any advantage it is in their lighter weight ball that may not carry as far.  My 40 loaded with about 35 grains of powder does no more damage than a 32.  My 25 is a far better small game rifle even though it also has to be loaded hot.  The 32, even with 15 grains of powder is still a pretty hot number and will disentegrate a squirrel head.  This being said, I think that they can be made into a better small game number if one could try even a 1-40 tin mix and possibly 1-30.  It does not take much to harden lead.  Were i to get a 32 now I would try that.  May try that in a 40 or try the "magnum" buckshot in my 25.  (I really do not need to buy another box as you get an awful lot of 25's in the 5 pounds of buckshot)

DP

well, I disagree with most of this...true, the Muzzle velocity of a .32 tends to be higher than a .22LR, but downrange performance of the .32 is ~ .22LR [which tends to retain more vel&en in flight]. The .36 is a similar deal with a little more oomph, but by the time you get to the .40 [in the old days .38 was a common squirrel/hog rifle ] you reach what some folks [not me] call a deer caliber. Whatever you call it, shooting a squirrel with a .40 or .45 is like shooting deer with a howitzer. But each to his own as my ol'pappy used to say.

[BrownBear]

I will point out one consideration about the small cals:  If you have an aversion to loading blocks, you aren't going to be happy with a 32, or for that matter a 36, when the weather cools for hunting.  I can't say about the 40 because I don't have one.

Those little balls and patches are tough to handle with cold fingers and/or gloves.  I sprayed balls and patches all over tarnation trying to load on hunts until I resorted to a loading block.  I'm kinda fumbly in the first place, but it was a ridiculous enterprise loading loose balls with cold fingers.

[northmn]

I have shot squirrels with both a 22 LR and a 32 and the 32 is far more devastating, but as Dan stated you need to head shoot anyway.  When we use a ML we are really trying to experience what GGGgranddad did back when.  Problem is we cannot.  My feelings on the small bores is that they kind of fit in that category of rifle we used to call trappers rifles, like the 25-20 and 32-20.  both worthless for much of anything by todays standards but fun to shoot.  Today the ML 40 is not considered a deer caliber.  We have been contaminated by modern experiences and modern thinking.  I suspect when GGrandad went hunting before game laws and what not, he shot what opportunity presented, be it squirrel, coon, turkey or deer.  The small bores gave them something that worked on about anything an Eastern hunter would encounter.  I remember last year sitting at the base of an oak waiting for a grey squirrel when a little spike buck walked through feeding on acorns.  Had this situation occured before game laws, I would have had a fat little spike as he came with a few feet of where I was sitting whether carrying a 32, 36 or 40.  That was how the old "trapper" calibers I mentioned were used.  Today we like to use "specialized" rifles and own several.  Were I to own one rifle to live off the land, where game laws do not exist, the 32 would work under the conditions I have encountered, although I still would prefer the 36 or 40.  Out west you would want something a little bigger.  By the way I had no problems handling the small buckshot to load the 25. 

DP

[BrownBear]

My feelings on the small bores is that they kind of fit in that category of rifle we used to call trappers rifles, like the 25-20 and 32-20.  both worthless for much of anything by todays standards but fun to shoot. 

That's kinda funny really, and certainly reflects differences in location and experience.  The 25-20 is about the most useful round I've ever owned.  It's my favorite cartridge for small game and fur bearers, and since it's legal here, I've actually whacked a couple of deer with it- in exactly the circumstances you describe.  Deer was close, I had the gun in my hands and careful shooting.  One lung shot and the other head shot, and both DRT.  I probably shoot 10 snowshoe hares with the 25-20 for every one that I shoot with 22 LR.  I also snap ptarmigan heads with it.  And it baps fox like even a 22 mag wishes it could.

Most of the critics I know of the 25-20 and 32-20 I know are not handloaders, and in fact the biggest critics I know locally have never shot one.   I've "turned" a couple of them simply by letting them shoot mine.  One session plinking on the beach at clam shells is about all it takes.

[Mike R]

I will point out one consideration about the small cals:  If you have an aversion to loading blocks, you aren't going to be happy with a 32, or for that matter a 36, when the weather cools for hunting.  I can't say about the 40 because I don't have one.

Those little balls and patches are tough to handle with cold fingers and/or gloves.  I sprayed balls and patches all over tarnation trying to load on hunts until I resorted to a loading block.  I'm kinda fumbly in the first place, but it was a ridiculous enterprise loading loose balls with cold fingers.

I would not be surprised if the reduction in bore sizes in the late MLing era was the cause of bullet blocks being used. Thye are not mentioned in the 18th or early 19th cent.  I have had no trouble loading my .32 with my fingers, but someone with thick, stubby ones sure might.

[Mike R]

The original questioner asked for comments on the .32. So, for my money it does not matter whether someone likes some other caliber better as an 'all-around' gun--the .32 is certainly not what I'd pick if I had only one rifle given the game variety I seek [although I admit to being partial to small game hunting]. The small ball [I shoot .310] is pretty light for heavy work. But sure enough it will kill deer with a proper shot--a buddy of mine killed a doe under his treestand with a .22CB [MV=725fps].  Some native populations [e.g., Eskimo, Panamanian Indians] have used .22s for all hunting up to Polar bears. The .32 will kill. It is ballistically similar to the .22LR but has a larger wound channel. But as a sportsman I would not use it for big game. If it is all I had I would use it when necesary. For years growing up the .22LR/.22Short were the only things I used for hunting. I know they will cleanly kill animals up to 50 lbs or more. The .32 will also. So why wack a squirrel with a .395 ball?  Only if it is all you have....

[hanshi]

I think it's safe to say that I've never met a gun I didn't like.  Of course zipguns and weird stuff like that don't count.  I have and use a .32 and a.36.  The .36 is my favorite simply because of the nice flint SMR that fires it.  If it was a .32 I'd be just as satisfied.  I don't have anything negative to say about either one. 

For some reason I've never encountered the destruction often mentioned by non .32 fans.  And I use a powerful load of 30 grains of 3f, too.  I often shoot squirrels in the middle (nothing there anyway) and it drops them DRT.  there's an entrance hole and a slightly (sometimes) larger exit hole.  It never cuts them in half nor makes a mess of anything.  Head shots?  Most any caliber will work for those.

I like small bores.  The .22 Hornet I've had for years has made several one shot kills-both neck shots and lung shots.  My favorite CF deer caliber of all time is the little .250/3000 which is like riding a tricycle in a bike race.  Placement is everything but on a squirrel-stay away from the shoulders and rear quarters-any shot works.  A pound of lead will give you twice the shots of a .40.  If you find a rifle you like, believe me, you'll be satisfied with it regardless if it's .32, .36 or even .40.

[northmn]

It is very possible that the head shots where the ball hits skull bones etc is what causes some of the rather nasty results.  I admit to being a little radical on this thread.  I think my disenchantment with the 32 came from shooting bullseye target matches.  The 32 lost it after about 50 yards.  Daryl mentions using about 35 grains to get accuracy beyond 25 yards.  I believe I also had to up the charge at that range.  Since I had to head shoot squirrels anyway I went to the 40 as it will perform up to 100 yards.  The 32 is a more specialized caliber in many ways than the 36 or 40.  I think Brownbear could make me a believer in the 25-20 also as my brother in law has a nice Marlin in that caliber.  That is very similar to the uses for a 36 or 40.  Some claim that a 36 works pretty fair on turkeys where allowed.  I have a few coyotes in the area that I like to keep honest and would not hesitate to them if squirrel hunting.  They can weigh over 40 pounds in this area.  Most people that have 32's really enjoy them, they are fun, but I just prefer other calibers in ML's.

DP

[BrownBear]

  I think Brownbear could make me a believer in the 25-20 also as my brother in law has a nice Marlin in that caliber. 

That''s the "trouble" with folks like you and I who enjoy what we do.  It doesn't take much more than "howdy" before we're talking each other into trying and buying new stuff.  And here I sit with two small Cochrain left handed locks looking for builds to land on, debating what calibers to build.  I'd been leaning toward matching 32 and 45, but there you go, singing the praises of a 40!    

[northmn]

I mentioned the 25-20 and 32-20 because my sources on histories of them stated that they were designed to be usable on both small game and deer.  In ML's if you look at downrange performance the 36 and 40 both perform somewhat similar.  The 32 is kind of a new kid on the block, as when I started shooting ML's the 36 was the squirrel rifle, with some claiming is was great on turkeys. I cut a lot of firewood and like to carry a firearm with me when I am out doing that.  Rifles in that class have a certain appeal to me.  Even thought about loading down a 30-30 with cast bullets for that use.  While esthetically a 395 ball sounds a little large for shooting small stuff, they really are not all that large and a head shot is a head shot.  Shot a lot of squirrels with a 45.  I also can occaisionally pop a ruffed grouse while putting up firewood.  Snow shoe rabbits are getting rare due to coyotes and I rarely see a track on my place anymore, but then I have mostly hardwoods.  I remember one a friend shot with his 32 and about 20-25 grains of powder.  About all that was left of th head was the ears and a lower jaw.  Most of the game shot with the 32 was at distances measured in feet.  I have never owned a 36 but almost bought a barrel for one last time around.

DP

[Dphariss]

The 32-36-40 all produce about the same result in squirrels. Pretty much removes the head.
Deer.
The long/market hunter could use a 40 caliber as a minimum caliber if he were mostly hunting deer for hides.
If in Kentucky on a long trip it would be advantageous since it takes little powder and lead. As a major plus it would not make a lot of noise. Deer, bear, elk even buffalo could be killed easily with properly placed head shots.
The 40 would also take care of men if the occasion called for it, though heavy clothing might cause problems, something I had not previously considered. This would require testing to resolve. When men enter the equation it changes things since shooting men a longer range is desirable sometimes and while a 45 will make a 150 yard shot the 4o might not. Hmmm. Do I see digressing here?

I have a friend who shot a lot of deer with a Winder Musket years ago. 22 LR in this case,  lungs or head both reportedly work OK.
So small bores will kill deer.
I found a collection that a friend subsequently bought, all "new" stuff but one good Irish ML shotgun that needed work. But it contained a Stevens favorite in 25 Stevens Rimfire. The cartridge is pretty much a scaled up 22 WRF. It came with a couple of full boxes of ammo and a partial. This was Remington smokeless stuff, old but serviceable. Its a popgun. Probably loaded that way to encourage people to buy something new or to keep Stevens Favorites from coming "unstuck".
Anyway probably made under 1000 FPS. But the former owners son said it was a great deer poacher. My dad has killed a few Caribou with the 22 WMRF but he uses head shots.
I shot some original  32-20 and some original 32-20 HV loads back in the 1960s. The HV load is a far different cartridge than the BP dup smokeless load.
But this has little to do with MLs really other than to point out that little bullets will kill large game when placed right.

Dan

[Dphariss]

PS having shot one deer with a BP loaded 38-40 the 32-20 at BP levels is not viable. Have a family history story about this but its a little off topic.

Dan