Golcher and Simpson Saint Paul

[bri_4623]

This is a family heirloom that we are interested in learning more about.  
Forgive my lack of terminology..newbie here.
Printed on the barrel and lock Golcher and Simpson Saint Paul
Removing the barrel from the stock reveals a maker's mark of
  E
 L G
  *
which has an oval around it.  There is also some numerals and initials there.  On one side of the barrel is printed 17.0 ans the other in the same area is printed 13.0.  Also in the area are the initials HA.  The barrels are two different sizes as well.  The gun appears to be adorned with two different metals, once brass, and the other I am unsure, it has a bit of rust, but could clean up to a silvery sheen.
Total Length 48"
Barrel Length 32 1/2"

I am looking for some history, an idea of insurance value, and wondering if I can/should clean it, or pay to have it restored.

Thanks in advance.

Here are the photos

[Nate McKenzie]

The L E G is a Belgium proof mark so the barrels were made in Liege, Belgium. Possibly the rest of the gun too.

[Mike Brooks]

The 13 and the 17 are the bore size in millimeters. Is the right barrel rifled? It doesn't have much value as it is in pretty poor condition. Probably $300 give or take $100. I'd just oil it and leave it at that.

[bri_4623]

I will have to check on the rifling...it might be hard to tell due to the condition.  Is it possible that the barrels are Belgian, but the locks and stock American?  I also found it interesting that there is no patchbox.  Any ideas on dates?  I have been researching this thing for years and have not seen anything even close.  I am pretty sure that the lock at least is William Golcher, St. Paul MN.  This has been in my husband's family for 4 generations in NJ.  Thanks for your help!

[T*O*F]

The gun is by William Golcher.  He worked in St. Paul from 1855-1873.  However, he was partnered with Simpson there from 1854-1857, so the gun can specifically be dated within that 4 year period.  It's a combination gun, one barrel rifled and the other smooth.  No doubt built from imported Belgian parts, at least the barrels and locks.

The inlaid metals could be gold, platinum, or silver and probably exceed the value of the gun if removed, especially if it's platinum.

It has no great value, either as is or restored.  Clean it up, oil it and leave it as is.  Don't take steel wool or sandpaper to it.  Oil up a piece of burlap or other coarse cloth and rub the metal down to remove the loose build-up and use a good paste wax on the wood.

I wouldn't even insure it.

[bri_4623]

Just checked the gun, and neither barrel is rifled.

[T*O*F]

Just checked the gun, and neither barrel is rifled.

A cursory look usually reveals nothing, as most are worn smooth at the muzzle.
Did you drop a bore light down the smaller bored one?
This is often the only means to ascertain if it's rifled, cause you can't see all the way to the breech.

[bri_4623]

Just checked the gun, and neither barrel is rifled.

A cursory look usually reveals nothing, as most are worn smooth at the muzzle.
Did you drop a bore light down the smaller bored one?
This is often the only means to ascertain if it's rifled, cause you can't see all the way to the breech.

Good point, and I don't have a bore light.  I will ask around though.  What would it mean if it were?  So basically this is a Belgian gun imported and assembled in St. Paul MN?  Either way is fine as I will oil it and hang it on the wall in my house, but it just doesn't add up.

[Tanselman]

Many shotguns, and related type weapons, were imported from Belgium in the mid-1800s. It was simple economics. In America most labor was working on farms, so it was expensive to find and hire labor that could build guns. In Europe it was just the opposite  because there was much less cheap farm land available to the common man, and more populated areas had excess labor available for manufacturing, so guns and gun parts could be made more cheaply. This SxS rifle/shotgun was undoubtedly imported, since it was less costly to buy than to build a gun like this in Minnesota, and other states, at that time. Golcher & Simpson ordered the gun, probably along with a lot of other sporting materials they sold in their store, then had a worker engrave their firm's name on the gun locks and barrel before retailing it in their store. A lot of pocket pistols sold in America at that time were also imported and marked with the retailing firm's name before being resold. Shelby Gallien

[Dan'l 1946]

Good point, and I don't have a bore light.  I will ask around though.  What would it mean if it were?  So basically this is a Belgian gun imported and assembled in St. Paul MN?  Either way is fine as I will oil it and hang it on the wall in my house, but it just doesn't add up.
[/quote]
 
I think the most important thing here is that it is a family heirloom. As has been said, oil it and display it and maybe try to document it as much as possible. Might find out some interesting family history.

[bri_4623]

Thank you everyone for your information.  I have gotten more in the last 24 hours than I have in 4 years of research    Awesome forum!

[Curt J]

I'd like to point out that there is a "GOLCHER & SIMPSON  St PAUL" rifle in our Library here. Check it out.

[bri_4623]

I'd like to point out that there is a "GOLCHER & SIMPSON  St PAUL" rifle in our Library here. Check it out.

I did see that before I posted, however, I did not see any resemblance.  Now I understand why.  Thanks again!