What is the trick to remove a breech plug from a Rice barrel?

[BILL OKLAHOMA CITY]

I need help.
thank you,
Bill

[Lucky R A]

Righty tighty, lefty loosie!   A good strong vise, and a minimum of a 12" adjustable wrench (preferably a bit larger)  Tighten the wrench down on the plug from the underside and give the wrench a smart hit with a mallet and screw out the plug. 

[Jim Filipski]

A couple of weeks working out in the Gym! Then tackle it.
They put them in tight   

[Acer Saccharum]

To keep the barrel from turning in the vise:
If your barrel is tapered, but the vise jaws are parallel, you will need a tapered shim or a set of maple inserts that fit the octagonal part.
Sprinkle the barrel with rosin, like violin rosin, for a better grip. The vise must be TIGHT. When you start leaning on the wrench, watch ththe barrel, to make sure it's not slipping.

To keep from buggering up the top flat of the breechplug:
I put my wrench on the plug from the underside. I don't let the tips of the wrench jaws go past the top finished surface of the plug. Inspect your wrench jaws to see that there are no burrs. File and polish any rough spots.

How many originals do we see with pipe wrench marks, toothy jaw marks, buggered up plugs, etc? Almost all original guns have been chewed up, probably for lack of a good vise.

[flehto]

I agree that Rice bbls sometimes have excessively tight breech plugs. Clamp the bbl tightly  in the vise between copper or brass jaws, place  copper or brass shims on either side of the bolster, use at least a 12" wrench from the underside of the bolster and whack w/ a mallet. Ensure you're aware of the right hand threads and unscew accordingly. Rice bbls have a larger shutoff shoulder at the bore level and this seems to be the reason for excessive tightness. Good luck....Fred

[Eric Krewson]

It took me a 12" crescent and a 3' piece of pipe and all most all my weight to get mine loose. It was so tight I felt I couldn't get it back where it was so I rebreached the plug to a different flat. First build so I probably didn't have  to rebreach but I felt uneasy about having to remove the plug a bunch of times during the build and having to use so much pressure to get it on the right flat every time. 

[Elnathan]

Also, make sure that you aren't clamping the barrel right on the threads themselves. That can make things more difficult.

[smylee grouch]

Thats right, clamp barrel back from breech end 1/2 plus inches or you could cace the barrel into the threads even tighter. I made a breech plug wrench out of two lenghts of 1" key stock. Two holes(5/16) on each side of a space of about 2", then I can tighten the 4 5/16 bolts to the contour of the plug so not to put those wrench dings in it.       Gary

[J.D.]

all good advise. I use a different approach with a set of Vee blocks made of hard oak. Clamp barrel in the blocks upside down, the barrel, not the blocks, and use an appropriate wrench.

I have been meaning to make a wrench similar to Gary's, with  one arm of the wrench about 18 inches long, but haven't gotten around to it.

God bless

[frogwalking]

I have not tackled a Rice barrel but have a large antique waterpump wrench that is very hard for a breechplug to resist.  It is kind of like an adjustable wrench that is an inch thick.  One can sometimes find them cheap in antique shops or flea markets.

[BILL OKLAHOMA CITY]

Thank you, very much, folks.
A larger vice.
maple shims.
12" adjustable wrench.
30" breaker pipe.

Got er done.

[Karl Kunkel]

I purchased a breech plug wrench similar to Gary's description from Stonewall Creek I believe. I would be simple to make, but his was reasonably priced.

[J.D.]

Thank you, very much, folks.
A larger vice.
maple shims.
12" adjustable wrench.
30" breaker pipe.

Got er done.

Maple Shims? NNNOOOOOOOO. Wooden shims, aka liners for the vise jaws will only allow the barrel to rotate in the vise, really making a mess of things.

If you pad the jaws of the vise, use something like 1/16" or thicker brass.

The wooden Vee blocks I mentioned are cut into a Vee shape on one side, to hold the barrel securely, and flat on the back.

I'll try to post a photo later today, when I get time.

God bless

[sean69]

For the benefit of people running across this thread in a search [like me]

trying to remove the plug from a Rice swamped barrel:

I had to make some copper jaws & shims to hold the barrel securely [jaws made out of an old copper pipe - took about 10 minutes a jaw. Then leaned on it with a very long wrench - I could actually hear the vice start to break loose. Gonna have to shore that up.

The plug turns out counter clockwise if the plug is facing/nearest you

Here's what it looks like:

[David Rase]

I use pretty much the same setup as sean69.  Heavy sheet brass jaws in a 5" vise.  Large 10" adjustable open end wrench and a wooden mallet.  One or two smacks and it is on it way out.
David 

[JBJ]

When you put it back, be sure and carefully align the index marks that Rice stamps on the bottom flat - no more and no less. I have better luck holding the barrel closer to the breech plug but not on the threaded area of the barrel.
J.B.

[alyce-james]

Bill ; Good afternoon Sir. I've used a 15 inch crescent wrench. I made and use wood maple tapered shims in a 71 pound machinest vice. One time years back I had to use a cheater pipe to extent the wrench handle length. Good luck. AJ.

[moleeyes36]

I went through this stuck breech plug thing a short time ago.  Look this referenced thread over:

If the plug doesn't come out easily, you might want to read through this thread before you apply brute force and possibly damage something (maybe yourself).  http://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=34631.0  Jerry's method of heating the breech end cherry red and letting it cool slowly really works well without fuss, muss, or possible damage to the tang or breech. 

Mole Eyes

[frogwalking]

Wow!  This thread will be drawing social security soon.  I have now built 3 rifles using Rice barrels.  I am also using a large hardware store vice, aluminum jaw pads and shims if required, and my trusty antique waterpump wrench.  I use thin aluminum flashing to shim the smaller ends, behind the aluminum vice jaws.  So far, so good.  The aluminum seems to be soft enough to mash a little if needed, but hard enough not to let the barrel slip.  I once tried flat wood jaw pads, and it didn't work well, causing the barrel to flip out of the vice and be damaged. 

[Turtle]

 I have two aluminum vise plates with 3 female inside flats each I got from Brownells years ago that work great holding octagon barrels in a vise. I never had to shim them for swampers.Don't know if they still have them.
                                                           Turtle

[retired fella]

I have used flat lead flashing before it becomes round ball.  No problem.

[kaintuck]

Coated the breach plug inside with peanut butter, left it in the shop overnight  in Dave's shop, and the mice undid it for me getting to the peanut butter.......


Tomtom

[Dphariss]

People should understand that high torque crush fitting of breechplugs is simply a short cut and is not necessary. Its possible to distort the bore if too much vise pressure in applied. Clamping heavily at the plug can tighten the barrel on the plug. If the breech is properly fitted long wrenches are not needed.
Breech plug fitting so that the plug can be removed and reinstalled without turning past takes some work with the wrench and file so that when the tang is properly aligned with the top flat and will not easily go farther if reinstalled. This can be done by brute force alone. But its not the best way.
Slow careful fitting will give the same result without all the stress on the parts or burring the end of the bore.


Dan

[Turtle]

 The tightest breech plugs I ever experienced were on TC Hawkens. These weren't corroded-just TIGHT!. Even with my vice blocks and the special TC breech plug wrenches, they were a bear. I ended up putting one in the freezer and heating the barrel. I agree that a properly fitted plug doesn't need to be so tight, but we sometimes need to deal with the cards we are dealt.
                                                         Turtle

[c deperro]

 I have had that problem twice. Your standard 4 or 6 inch vice that you buy from the hardware store just wont cut it. You need a heavy duty vice. I now use a old post vice with copper lined jaws and an 18 crescent wrench. It worked like a charm on them.