which flintlock building book to buy?

[JTR]

Go for it A-D!
About the closest thing to a blue print that you're going to find are these at track of the Wolf. These plans were mentioned in the first reply, and here's a link to them;

http://www.trackofthewolf.com/Categories/PartList.aspx?catID=15&subID=175&styleID=954

You'll note there are no dimensions on the plans because all the various components, barrels, locks, trigger guards, etc,  come in various sizes, so obviously the dimensions would be useless except for the exact set of components that the plan was scaled to. However once you have your components it'll be easy enough to dimension the stock from your components.

Enjoy your new adventure, and please posts some pictures of your progress for us.

John
 

[Dphariss]

with a 2D blueprint i can make 3D models of the part just fine, this allows me to test the final fit of the parts dimensionally to see if there are any major arrors to take note of, if so i can correct those errors on the 3D model and then print out patterns to make the parts so once theyre done according to the patterns, far less fitting actually needs to be done

This is assuming you know how the parts REALLY work together.
Firearms or the era we are discussing are designed to be hand fit. They were all designed long before interchangable parts etc. Even cast parts need to be properly reshaped to work right.
Once the design is tested and proven to be workable it is possible to make parts on a CNC or some such.
But having someone who does not understand how everything works together set up the machines or make thge drawings is a major mistake.

Failure to have an adequate understanding of lock making. Such as how the fly must work and be shaped to make the lock SAFE. How the sear and tumbler notches need to be shaped to prevent ACCIDENTAL DISCHARGES.
Its not likely that you or people around you are going to be killed or injured by a violin malfunction. Firearms malfunctions can be more serious.
So thinking that being able to shape wood into a musical instrument make you capable of building a safe rifle lock from bar stock or castings is seriously optimistic.

Dan

[jwh1947]

Dixon's

[David Rase]

If I could only have one LR building book, it would be Recreating The American Longrifle by Buchele, Shumway and Alexander.  But, I also have the other ones mentioned and they are good too.
-Ron

I second what Ron said.
DMR

[44-henry]

One other one that comes to mind is McCrory's The Modern Kentucky Rifle. It was written in the 1960's and much has changed concerning availability of parts and a more critical eye towards styling and historical correctness; however, it was probably one of the first books to introduce folks to building muzzleloading rifles and will still do the job. I built a rifle in high school using this book as a guide (lack of anything else at the time) and it certainly served to get the job done, though the rifle itself wasn't much to look at. This book, like many of the others mentioned, details building components such as the patchbox, sideplate, upper and lower pipes and other various parts and it does come with a full size plan, though the architecture is somewhat crude by modern conventions. Still for less that $10 it is a steal and one that should be on any builders shelf if for no other reason than the history that surrounds it.

[animus_divinus]

We just brought in a 3D printer in our university lab that does allow one to print parts directly from CAD files and I have CAD files that I created of the Wheellock in Lauber's book (probably the wheellock you mentioned earlier), I suppose that I can print it out to test function, but who really wants a plastic wheellock? You will find that machine tools will come in handy, but there is a point where you just have to pick up a hand tool to complete the job and nothing beats experience and artistic ability at that point.

Plastic wheel lock parts would be great.  Scaled suitably oversize to account for shrinkage and printed out of the appropriate plastic, investment castings can be made directly from these parts.  Think of these as the waxes in the investment casting process.  Very doable.

i was actually considering making one wheellock out of stainless.. but will probably just go mild steel and heat treat

[animus_divinus]

to the guy who mentioned not knowing how the lock and parts work... well, drawing out a majority of the parts do actually work well.. however, i do have a few issues such as that of the sear some some disconnector type piece not fitting together properly, and had to tweak the flash pan a bit... but in all the parts are going together with tight tolerances, and best of all in solidworks i can actually move one part, and the corresponding parts move too... for example, when i spin the wheel it tugs on the chain connected to the mainspring to a point where the ball detent falls into play and locks the wheel in place... so i can simulate a full range of motion here to verify all parts with corrected dimensions work out fine

so far things ive had to correct is for example two holes drilled into the plate which are there so pins of another part can fit through to copper solder the component to the plate... i moved the pins on the piece needing to be soldered in to match the holes in the plate... since the surface being soldered mounts flush youd never notice a change was made

one last thing.. i am looking for dimensions to a specific lock, at this point any lock, and ill be making the wheellock parts the same way most of them were made so long ago... with a bunch of metal files and a lot of time.. i was planning on doing the flintlock pieces in a similar way

[Dave B]

AD, I found a copy of the plan from the book Recreating the American Long rifle on Ebay its auction number 360297774805  The rifle and pistol shown are full size on the plan.  I believe the design is that of Fredric Sell from littletown school of rifle making. But for the price its a good example of what you would be getting with the book.

[animus_divinus]

well, track of the wolf lists the chapters in each of the book.. none of them really go into detail with building the actually components of the lock or really too in depth on the stock... seems to be mostly generalization and history lessons as stated.. however the $6.50 patterns or so do give pretty complete detail of the rifle showing dimensions, cross sections and what not of just about any type of traditional rifle which is basically what im looking for most

no need to make a lock anyway, already have a matchlock and a wheellock as future projects ;-)... so most likely ill go to muzzleloader builders supply, order the siler large lock castings, the buttplate, trigger guard, breechplug, barrel (might actually go .54 cal on it) the double set trigger, buttplate... priced it out and the shopping cart came out to about $270 considering i was ordering as many sand cast parts as i could to bring the cost down.. sure its going to take more work with a dremel and a sanding wheel to smooth up the sandcast parts... im fine with the extra work... and then buy the patterns from track of the wolf for the rifle im going after.. at this point ill probably go with an older jaeger design

by the way... the information supplied for carving out a stock is basically the same kind of templates one would expect for carving a guitar neck.. top profile, side profile and some cross sections to make radius templates out of to check here and there when you get close to the final shape....

so youve all been a help here so far, and now i know what i must do... ill update with some photos later, and those of the matchlock thatll most likely come second because i have to tell you.. this wheellock is going to take forever getting right with the blueprints i have

[animus_divinus]

http://www.trackofthewolf.com/(X(1)S(b2j5ld45dcvpfyzvcre5zr45))/imgPart/aag-443_2.jpg

does anyone agree that is absolutely gorgeous?

[rich pierce]

Steve Zihn, I presume?

[Mike Brooks]

http://www.trackofthewolf.com/(X(1)S(b2j5ld45dcvpfyzvcre5zr45))/imgPart/aag-443_2.jpg

does anyone agree that is absolutely gorgeous?

It has some real problems in the lock panel area, so I guess I disagree.

[Dphariss]

http://www.trackofthewolf.com/(X(1)S(b2j5ld45dcvpfyzvcre5zr45))/imgPart/aag-443_2.jpg

does anyone agree that is absolutely gorgeous?

It has some real problems in the lock panel area, so I guess I disagree.

Ditto.

Dan

[bob in the woods]

I've built more than 1 gun that I thought was pretty darn nice; until I had someone who knew better point out the areas that ' weren't right".  That example on TOW has some serious problems that stand out to even my less than experienced eyes.  I couldn't live with it, even though I'm sure that it functions just fine.

[Jim Kibler]

Animus,

Your enthusiasm is great and it's always nice to see new people involved with this stuff.  I must say, if your goal is to make a fine rifle, I get the feeling you are underestimating the complexity of it.  This is not to discourage you, but to encourage you to slow down a bit, study all the rifles you can, read all you can, and ask lots of questions.  The process of learning to build a fine rifle is more of a marathon than a sprint.  In fact for some of us it's a never ending journey.  If you think I can help, just ask.  Good luck!

Jim

[animus_divinus]

i was actually referring to the color scheme on the lock and the decorations on the stock which are not engravings, but raised sections someone had to carve around with a chisel... i wonder how they got the screws on the lock to come out blue like that

[animus_divinus]

looking at photos of some other designs, i see the raised decorations a lot more... i dont think ill be able to do anything this fancy as of yet, im not all that artistic in that sense, so i would have to transfer images from paper and go over them with chisels and an exacto knife, but thats for a later piece of work... however some of these engravings with brass inlay i could do at a later time after the rifle has been built

maybe ill go for a more utilitarian build first, with function and comfort more in mind than aesthetics for an all around outdoors rifle im not afraid to get muddy, then i can take my time on something more beautiful later

[44-henry]

The screws look like they have a fire blue which can be done with a hand torch, heat treat furnace, or with a nitre bath. You can try it yourself with a polished steel screw and a small torch, just heat up the part slowly and watch the colors change from shades of straw to the bright blue. The big problem is to control the temperature and keep the part uniformly heated. Brownells sells nitre salts that you can use for this process, though you can get them cheaper from other sources.

[Acer Saccharum]

You may find it will take several guns before you understand the language of the longrifle. In the beginning you may understand the words, and you will soon be able to construct a sentence. But it takes years of study and practice to be able to write poetry.

I feel like I am just working up to writing a good short story. Working up to a novel. Poetry comes later.

[Don Getz]

I would like to know what part of the world you are from?   Based on your writing I would think you are probably from
somewhere in europe?    Am I correct?   If you live somewhere in the USA it would help to know where, then we could
refer you to some people or places that could be helpful...........Don

[animus_divinus]

i am in the united states, but i am far from any major city, so there will be no help here besides what i get online... looking at the plans on track of the worlf im liking either the isaac haines type, and the hawken so far.

[Acer Saccharum]

i am in the united states, but i am far from any major city, so there will be no help here besides what i get online... looking at the plans on track of the worlf im liking either the isaac haines type, and the hawken so far.

Most of us are far from any major city.

It is going to be very hard to build a gun from completely on line information. If you found someone near you, you could hook up and compare ideas and see how things are done in person.

I live in upstate NY, near Albany. That's not compromising my security much. If you live nearby, you can PM me. Come over and get a basic tour of how the guns go together, and you can show me how to carve.

Tom

[Don Getz]

Animus............I wasn't trying to be nosey, just thought it would be helpful if we knew where you live.   We have forum
members from all over the place, most of whom would be willing to share their gunbuilding experience with you.  On the
other hand, you might be involved in a cult, in which case I could see why you wouldn't want us to know where you live.....................Don

[Dr. Tim-Boone]

i just made this account today, and have been busy so of course i havent had the opportunity to fill it out, im in northern PA... actually im not far from where the pennsylvania rifles origionally came from... and why does not having info on my profile cause concerns? afraid im going to make a bunch of muzzleloaders and sell them to local gangs?... hah (joking)

That doesn't seem like so far away............Wayne are you playing games??

[animus_divinus]

nope, not part of any cult... and well, im going to order a set of stock patterns from track of the wolf to carve and inlet a stock to match probably a 7/8" barrel and a flint lock, i just have to decide right now which of their patterns are going to give me what i want, so my choices are the isaac haines type, or maybe even the half-stock hawken