Author Topic: Percussion, with a twist (Read 10463 times)

gibster · « **on:** October 17, 2010, 04:26:19 AM »

I read with interest all the comments on the topic, PERCUSSION, and thought that I would post what I am currently working on. I wanted to build a percussion as several of you have mentioned, but wanted something a little different. I have seen a few original rifles that were converted to percussion using the original flint hammer and have always liked them. In fact, there was one at the show in Norris, Tennessee this past April. I have yet to see a contemporary rifle with this configuration. Anyway, I had an original flint plate that I used (the pan was already cut off), Siler internals and used an original hammer for the "conversion". I have a ways to go before it will be shootable, but it's a start. The fun part was getting the shoulder of the hammer to strike the lock plate and the nipple at the same time. The flint hammer is weaker in the throat than a regular percussion hammer would be due to its smaller diameter and may be why there's not many originals out there and may also be why contemporary makers don't build them. And it could be that people just don't like the looks of this type of conversion. Don't know. but I like the looks and thought I would give it a try. The barrel is a Bill Large .50 cal., 44-inches long. It will be finished as "poor boy" style with no butt plate and forged guard. Just a plain jane shooter. I'll post more pictures once it's complete. Here is a picture of the inletted lock.

wattlebuster · « **Reply #1 on:** October 17, 2010, 06:58:01 AM »

First one ive ever seen VERY intresting.I like

BJH · « **Reply #2 on:** October 17, 2010, 04:42:14 PM »

There's a Jacob Dickert illustrated in one book or another with the same round about style of conversion. I just don' remember wich book....

Dphariss · « **Reply #3 on:** October 17, 2010, 04:56:01 PM »

Yeah its different but you will have a lot of cap fragments flying around.
So be warned. I would cup the block in the cock jaws about 1/4" deep.

Dan

T*O*F · « **Reply #4 on:** October 17, 2010, 04:56:22 PM »

Quote

it could be that people just don't like the looks of this type of conversion.
I'll post more pictures once it's complete.

Please include pictures of your impending eye surgery after unrestrained\uncontained cap fragments imbed themselves in your eyeball, nose, and forehead.

Frizzen · « **Reply #5 on:** October 17, 2010, 06:03:37 PM »

Here is mine I have used for years. No problems.

Dave Dolliver · « **Reply #6 on:** October 17, 2010, 06:18:29 PM »

There is an example of this type of conversion on an antique Northwest Gun in the State Capital Historical Museum in Olympia, WA. It has a cavity in the iron block to surround the percussion cap.

Dave Dolliver

T*O*F · « **Reply #7 on:** October 17, 2010, 07:16:22 PM »

Quote

Here is mine I have used for years. No problems.

Phil,
There's a helluva lot of difference between a pistol held at arms length and a rifle where your face is only inches away.

gifford · « **Reply #8 on:** October 17, 2010, 07:36:11 PM »

Phil - I recall seeing one fellow club member shooting a conversion flint to percussion rifle that included at least part of if not most of the frizzen into the conversion mechanism. I know I surprised to see how it worked, naturally didn't have a camera with me to take picture. G

Frizzen · « **Reply #9 on:** October 17, 2010, 07:43:46 PM »

Think your right TOF, and my lock being mounted backwards the frizzen would keep cap
fragments away from me.

whitebear · « **Reply #10 on:** October 17, 2010, 09:49:11 PM »

I saw a rifle maid by Bob Watts of Stone Mountain Georgia that had a flint lock mounted on the wright side as would be correct for a right handed shooter

that used a conversion similar to Frizzens. It's been years but I believe that Bob increased the height of the fence as much as possible and the frizzen was kicked over in fired position.

If I can remember the shooters name I will try to get pictures and post them.

gibster · « **Reply #11 on:** October 17, 2010, 09:55:57 PM »

Trust me, there will be a recess for the nipple. As I stated, it will be a while before it is shootable. I appreciate the input and concern. Anyway, just wanted to show that there are ways to build a percussion and still have a late flint style rifle and still be historically accurate. As I said, there are some originals out there with this type of conversion.

Ken G · « **Reply #12 on:** October 20, 2010, 04:31:43 AM »

Gibster,
Sorry I missed your original post. Here's a picture of that original you were referring to. I've always thought it was one of the coolest conversions I have ever seen and I've never seen anyone do a contemporary version. Good goings giving it a shot. It'll be an interesting gun.

Steve Bookout · « **Reply #13 on:** October 20, 2010, 04:46:08 AM »

Nice project, Gibster. Hope to see it when you get'er done. It's fun being different, ain't it? Just ask me...I actually LIKE Ken Guy!

Cheers, Bookie

Ken G · « **Reply #14 on:** October 20, 2010, 04:52:21 AM »

Bookie,
I'll drop by ye Ol' Moon Pie factory and pick you up a little present for the comment. Say something else nice about me and I'll make them double deckers instead of them stinking mini moons. hehehehe

Ken

tallbear · « **Reply #15 on:** October 20, 2010, 05:42:58 AM »

Here's one off a New England rifle in my collection.

Mitch

Dphariss · « **Reply #16 on:** October 20, 2010, 04:11:44 PM »

I guess I should point out that just because it was made in the old days and looks cool in no reason to make it today.
Though I understand the desire for such work.
TOFs comments on the cap fragments might seem a little extreme but they are certainly valid.
I won't even make a drum and nipple gun and this one of the reasons why.
I have had cuts on my face from cap fragments when I was younger when using a D&N gun.
So I tend to be a little more conservative and only build percussion guns with breeches with good fences around the nipple.

Dan

Levy · « **Reply #17 on:** October 20, 2010, 05:23:59 PM »

Many years ago, I purchased a cheap flintlock mechanism from Dixe Gun Works and it didnt fire worth a darn on the gun that I built. In an effort to salvage the gun and still be able to use the lock I'd purchased, I did exactly what you did and it worked perfectly as a percussion.

James Levy

Roger Fisher · « **Reply #18 on:** October 20, 2010, 05:53:10 PM »

Does seem like a lot of stress on a skinny gooseneck hammer; but sure would work. I have seen one or 2 such over the years and seem to recall one at least did still have the frizzen on.

The fact that a nice deep recess for the nipple nose is a must is a given.

I did witness a shooter get a piece of cap (2 different folks) twice over several years and with a normal percussion lock. It taught one of them to start shooting with glasses after his face trailed blood.

T*O*F · « **Reply #19 on:** October 20, 2010, 08:06:43 PM »

Anyone who has shot a lot with a double gun can attest that at the end of the days shooting, the left wrist stings and is peppered with cap and powder fragments......and this in a properly made percussion lock. These direct everything down, whereas the one in question would direct them in all directions in the shape of a half circle.

Collector · « **Reply #20 on:** October 20, 2010, 08:22:03 PM »

Very interesting project. On inspection/observation, the steel inserts which substitute for the flints, on the original and Frizzens' pistol as well, appear to be either 'anchored' around the jaw screw or directly by the jaw screw, via a drilled hole, to keep it aligned properly with the nipple.

The only original flintlock lock plate that I have that was used to fabricate a percussion weapon, did keep a portion of the rear of the pan to act as a fence, to at least try to mitigate cap fragments. I'm sure that you'll undertake 'due care,' if/when you decide to shoot it.

Good luck!

LURCHWV@BJS · « **Reply #21 on:** October 21, 2010, 03:17:41 AM »

Until recently all I knew was percussion, Never dream I would shoot a Rock Lock. I've always noticed with percussion caps there is almost always something hitting my face upon firing. Especially from My 1858 Cattlemans Carbine, The closer the cap is to your face the more chance you have for a strike. Please wear safety glasses when shooting.

Rich

Ken G · « **Reply #22 on:** October 21, 2010, 05:42:42 AM »

Guys,
I'll say up front that I don't shoot a percussion so understand why I ask the question. I don't see any issue with using a chunk of steel bar mounted in flint jaws provided you have a deep enoughrecess in the bar to cover the cap when it goes off. Am I missing something? Assuming of course you are wanting to build something representing a flint converted to percussion in a period manner.
Ken

K. Moyer · « **Reply #23 on:** October 26, 2010, 02:38:06 AM »

Check out this Brown Bess conversion on TOW !http://www.trackofthewolf.com/imgPart/AAJ-007_1.jpg

Daryl · « **Reply #24 on:** October 26, 2010, 05:37:34 PM »

Quote from: Ken Guy on October 20, 2010, 04:31:43 AM

Gibster,
Sorry I missed your original post. Here's a picture of that original you were referring to. I've always thought it was one of the coolest conversions I have ever seen and I've never seen anyone do a contemporary version. Good goings giving it a shot. It'll be an interesting gun.

Note in the original, the fence is still somewhat operational. Reducing the height of the nipple so the hamemr curls over further as in the original and hollowing out the nose of the 'ram' will both help make the lock safer.

News:

Author Topic: Percussion, with a twist (Read 10463 times)

Dave Dolliver

gifford

Levy

LURCHWV@BJS

Daryl