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Author Topic: Southern Rifle Marked "J.*.G"  (Read 8576 times)

Offline Sequatchie Rifle

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Southern Rifle Marked "J.*.G"
« on: January 03, 2011, 02:28:30 AM »
Iron-mounted Southern Rifle
Approximately .47 caliber
Swamped Barrel 46 1/4 inches long, 1 inches across the flats at the muzzle
Overall Length 63 1/4 inches long
LOP (if I correctly measured it) 15 1/2 inches
Long Tang with distinctive "spade" finial.
Trigger Guard is massive.

Marked "I. *.G" I believe the "I" to be a "J".

Could this rifle have links to Jacob Gross of Sullivan County, TN?

I'd appreciate your thoughts.

« Last Edit: September 06, 2022, 10:30:33 PM by Sequatchie Rifle »
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Offline Dennis Glazener

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Re: Southern Rifle Marked "J.*.G"
« Reply #1 on: January 03, 2011, 03:36:07 AM »
A re-stock for sure but zero in on the metal work, sure would like to have seen the original rifle. Those triggers are just great.
Dennis
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Offline gibster

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Re: Southern Rifle Marked "J.*.G"
« Reply #2 on: January 03, 2011, 04:19:21 AM »
I agree with this being a restock.  I'd venture to say that the original rifle had the tang extend over the comb.  The closeup of the back of the tang looks to be broken.  I really like the metal on this.  Even as a restock, it's still a nice piece.
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Offline okieboy

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Re: Southern Rifle Marked "J.*.G"
« Reply #3 on: January 03, 2011, 07:29:38 PM »
 Thanks for the pictures of the inside of the patchbox. I also love that rear sight.
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Offline G-Man

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Re: Southern Rifle Marked "J.*.G"
« Reply #4 on: January 03, 2011, 08:09:19 PM »
Not much to add to what the others have said, other than the detailing on the rear sight and triggers do not look to me to be very similar to those on the famous Jacob Gross rifle.  But hard to tell.  It's not like these guys had a milling machine and set of specs to work from so I am sure their work would vary from piece to piece.  I would agree it had a longer tang at one time.  Super hardware with nice file work - looks like the original thimbles are missing though.  An old restock that saw a lot of use both before and after the restocking.   

Guy
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Offline G-Man

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Re: Southern Rifle Marked "J.*.G"
« Reply #5 on: January 03, 2011, 10:04:05 PM »
Those mounts are pretty stylized - note the extra long comb extension on the buttplate.  In its original form, the tang possibly went all the way up to the buttplate.  1830+/- seems to be about the earliest consensus on the fully evolved East Tennessee mountain rifle style and once it was there, it did not change much even through the later 19th century.   So if I had to venture a guess I would estimate the barrel and hardware from somewhere between the 1830s and 1850s, maybe right around 1835-40.  Flintlocks continued in use well after percussion locks were available.  

How much swamp is in the barrel?  Do you have the breech and "waist" measurements?

Neat stuff - thanks for posting the link to the photos.

Guy
« Last Edit: January 03, 2011, 10:05:58 PM by Guy Montfort »
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mike e

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Re: Southern Rifle Marked "J.*.G"
« Reply #6 on: January 04, 2011, 05:59:04 AM »
It looks like the furniture from the Gross rifles in "Notes on Southern Longrifles II" but they all signed a plate on top of the barrel. The Jacob Gross rifle is signed "J.Gross for A.B." on a silver plate.  Maybe only the real fancy rifles were signed that way. Volume I says there was Jacob Gross Sr, Jr, and another that lived about the same time as Jr. but went to Arkansas.
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Offline louieparker

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Re: Southern Rifle Marked "J.*.G"
« Reply #7 on: January 19, 2020, 01:28:24 AM »

Sequatchie Rifle ...  I think its more likely by Jonathan Gross... Some of his work is more like Alfred's than Jacob's...Just my opinion......LP
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Offline Sequatchie Rifle

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Re: Southern Rifle Marked "J.*.G"
« Reply #8 on: January 19, 2020, 04:51:43 AM »
Thanks for the info. I’ll dig through my reference material to see if I can dig up some info on him.
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Offline louieparker

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Re: Southern Rifle Marked "J.*.G"
« Reply #9 on: January 19, 2020, 05:13:59 AM »
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Offline Cades Cove Fiddler

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Re: Southern Rifle Marked "J.*.G"
« Reply #10 on: January 19, 2020, 05:40:13 AM »
 :) :)... Louie and Bill,.... that Jonathan Gross rifle was on display at the Alabama show,... she is a nice one now owned and graciously shared on display by a member,.... I am still on the hunt for that "J. Gross for A.B." rifle,.... would really like to see in person,... regards,... CCF...
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Offline louieparker

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Re: Southern Rifle Marked "J.*.G"
« Reply #11 on: January 19, 2020, 05:54:36 AM »
Look at the trigger guard construction.. Jacob made the grip rail and bow from one piece of metal..Jonathan and Alfred used two pieces. Jonathan was about nine years older (1813) than Alfred 1822.  So Alfred may have copied Jonathan  ???   We see more of Alfred's work. So I have always gave him credit for the guard design..But that may not be correct..I have seen one Alfred Duncan with the same style guard.. All of the Alfred guards I have inspected are of the same design..Some bigger than others but same design.  Attaching a photo of a Jacob guard.. Jacob was born in 1790.  Jacob was the father of Alfred and Jonathan.  LP








« Last Edit: January 19, 2020, 06:01:32 PM by Ky-Flinter »
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Offline bama

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Re: Southern Rifle Marked "J.*.G"
« Reply #12 on: January 19, 2020, 06:54:06 PM »
One of the great things that I have noticed about the Gross family of gunsmiths is that they combined the use of brass and silver along with their finely hand forged guards and butt plates. They were very talented craftsmen.

Louie, I would pay for your room if I could get you to bring that baby to the Alabama show next year. ;D
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Offline Cades Cove Fiddler

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Re: Southern Rifle Marked "J.*.G"
« Reply #13 on: January 23, 2020, 05:37:20 PM »
 :o :o :o... Thanx for the x-tra pix, Bill,.... I gotsta come see this one,... AND the others,... !!!,.... regards,. Cades Cove Fiddler,....
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Offline JTR

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Re: Southern Rifle Marked "J.*.G"
« Reply #14 on: January 23, 2020, 08:07:32 PM »
Wow! That one looks straight out of the barn!
What a great find!
John
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