Set Triggers

[George F.]

How come nobody makes universal set triggers that have a longer distance between the front and rear triggers? This would enable  a much easier placement of the triggers where the wrist at the breech area had to be placed because of a misplaced ram rod hole. 1/8" more spread in the distance would mean longer trigger bars and actually allow us to engage the front and rear triggers on the sear. I know I have always had a hard problem with this. I actually made new triggers for a gun, but the real problem was the trigger bars were not long enough.  Any input on this I forgot to mention the triggers I'm talking about are the Davis. I know Jim Chambers sells his Davis triggers with a higher trigger bar, but the problem is that they're the same length.  ...Geo.

[smallpatch]

George,

Not sure I understand.  If you mount the set triggers so the sear is directly centered between the two triggers, they will both reach.

Did I miss something.  It's totally possible.

[George F.]

I'll try my best. Let's say that the distance between a Davis front and rear trigger at the pivot pins is 1-1/2". That way the vertical  distance that they would be effective lets say would be 3/8" from the outside face of the plate to the sear bar. Sometimes you can't get both the front and rear trigger to engage the sear bar because the vertical distance is to great for various reasons, mostly the ramrod hole  has drifted towards the bottom of the stock. Now if the trigger pivot pins were 1-5/8" apart, the trigger bars would be 1/8" longer on each trigger, thus giving you the added reach. Thicker trigger bars don't seem to get there. The higher bars seem to get in the way so that the only way you can get the lock to cock is to set the triggers, which I feel is inherently dangerous.  If you file the higher bars down so you can cock the lock, then the triggers won't function. Also sometimes the rear trigger will get caught behind the sear after it has tripped the lock, and that's a pain. I'm sure others have had these problems, and I thought if the trigger bars were longer it would solve the problem. Of course new molds would have to be made for the trigger parts but I made sense to me..... Geo.

[jim m]

maybe I'm missing something too, but you can also heat[carefully] the sear bar on the lock and bend to help align with triggers. that's what I did on the last one. bent a small dog leg in the sear bar and everything worked out great. you clamp the sear bar in the vise and that works as a heat sink. hope this didn't just add to the confusion

[P.W.Berkuta]

I think I know what you are saying . I had to add a additional length of O-1 to the top of each Davis triggers on one of my rifles to get it to fire set or unset. When I did add the extensions I could not set the triggers because as they "cam ed" down the added extension interfered with the other trigger. To get it to set correctly I ended up filing a relief just above the engagement notch of the two triggers so that the triggers could be set without rubbing on the extension added trigger bars. Sounds confusing  .

[George F.]

It's a good thing parts are mass produced. I tried heating the sear on a pistol I was building after cleaning up the casting lines on the internals left the sear just a tad below the lock plate and melted it with the torch. I guess I need more experience with a oxy-acetylene torch. I only use a plumbers "B" tank with acetylene.  I just think that the trigger bars should be longer. It certainly solve this problem easier than all the other half a_ _ ideas I've tried ... Geo.

[Lucky R A]

Oh boy, George you really have me confused.  You seem to be describing at least three different problems.  In one case you want trigger bars to reach the sear.  In the next instance you talk about grinding down the high bars so you can take the pressure off the sear to alloy you to cock the lock.  In the third instance you talk about the trigger bar getting caught behind the lock sear.
# 1 problem  Your triggers are not set into the stock far enough.  You indicated that due to  ram rod hole run out you apparently can not  correctly place the triggers.  In this case a higher bar may be needed, but only if you can not adjust the lock sear downward a bit to take up the difference.  If the triggers are correctly placed fore and aft there is no reason they should not work correctly.   In the second case if you have to grind down the normal trigger bars to allow the lock to cock properly, you may have set the triggers a bit too deep.  You can shim the front out a bit. grind the bars down for a little clearance or bend the lock sear up or a combination.  In the third instance if one of the trigger bars slips past the lock sear your fore or aft placement is off.  On Davis locks the little adjustment screw should fall just to the rear of the lock sear, and your triggers should work correctly...if I am not confused!

[George F.]

Yes Lucky(How'd you earn that nickname), I was never one known for explaining things so people could understand me well. I get it from my Dad. My friends call me the great communicator. Back to triggers... I am aware of the placement of the screw on the plate being centered on the sear. Also of getting the plate up close to the sear bar. I don't like a trigger plate buried into the bottom of the stock. What I personally do is get my stock down to where I have between 1/8"-1/4" below the ramrod hole and inlet my trigger plate flush to that with some sanding of the stock and filing and if needed bending of the plate to fit the profile of the stock.  Sometime I get a ramrod hole a little lower and that brings the the stock profile  a little lower affecting the engagement of the trigger bars/sear bar. What I would like to see a manufacturer make a trigger assembly with the pivot points 1/8" farther apart, thus making the trigger bars longer so that aligning these parts( sear and trigger bars) a much easier proposition. That's all I was asking. As for the trigger plate getting stuck behind the sear bar is because the bottom of the stock ended up thicker /deeper than intended due to a ram rod hole slightly lower than intended. It doesn't take much. I have tried the Chamber's high bar triggers and the bar is only thicker mostly in the center, and not on the ends where the bar strikes the sear. Does this make any sense to you yet?

[don getz]

I'm not really sure  that I understand what you thought you said.  I find it hard to beleive that you want set triggers with
the two triggers farther apart....heck, the ones we have now require a guard witha big, big bow.  Actually, there is a place for double set triggers, but, in most kentuckies I prefer a good single trigger....no need to change them for me.....
Don

[smallpatch]

George,

I think I get what you're talking about now.  I'm not sure, short of making your own, that anyone is going to mass produce such a set trigger.

The only other solution lies with getting that stock thin enough.  You must be building some beasts.  Maybe it's time to put them stocks on a diet?? 

Just kidding.

Most of the problem I've had with set triggers, is getting the bars thinned down enough to use in them skinny little stocks.  I've had a couple that I have thinned down so much that there really wasn't enough bar left to trip the sear.

Like Don said, it's been a long time since I've installed a set trigger.  A well installed single trigger and a good lock.....really don't need a set trigger.

Hope with all the confusion, you got some help out of this.

[George F.]

Personally I would rather have a simple trigger. My trigger finger is gone and have to use my middle finger which I can't feel very good with and can't bend it very well. I have shot set triggers and since I can't feel what it's touching very well the rifle has discharged down range unexpectedly a few times.  Thanks for the tips.....Geo.

[jerrywh]

George .
  This is your big chance. Start making them and selling them. You can get rich.

[George F.]

Hey Jerry I've never had "money" If I ever got it, I'd Have to have all my friends tell me how to spend it.

[flintriflesmith]

If the ramrod hole drifts down the barrel can simply be inlet deeper by enough to not only solve this problem but keep the stock from looking pregnant.

Gary

[don getz]

I am in the process of assembling a Beck rifle, in the white, for a friend.  He wants double set triggers in it, and, initially
didn't think they would work.  A Beck rifle has a rather sharp break in the area of the trigger and I didn't think I could
bend a Davis double set that much.  The trigger plate had to be bent right behind the back trigger, and I had to move
the tail end of the trigger plate down about 1/2".   So, I stuck it in a vise, got the torch out and heated it that one spot
and made the bend without any trouble.  My worry was that the spring would not work in this position, however, my
worries were for naught, works like a dandy.  I then straightened the front trigger, just so it wouldn't look like a Davis
double set right out of the box.  Will get some pictures and get someone to post them.....Don

[Roger Fisher]

Centering the sear in the center of the two trigger bars has been okay for me but I build an average rifle in more ways than one!!

The Davis double sett is so far what I use.  I have one such in my 1989 offhand shooter that has many thousands & thousands of rounds thru her and have yet to have the triggers out to re 'edge' the latch area or even to move the adjusting screw>

In fact the thought crossed my mind a time or three that maybe I should see if that screw is rusted tight??  But; I sat down in my lazy boy til the feeling left me

What I'm saying is if it ain't broke don't fix it!