Author Topic: ..."make it shoot higher"  (Read 11441 times)

Offline D. Taylor Sapergia

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..."make it shoot higher"
« on: June 29, 2011, 12:57:31 AM »
That's what Roy said to me.  But here's the problem.  The barrel on Roy's smoothbore 20 gauge is the same diameter at the wedding ring as at the breech and then a straight taper to the muzzle.  The little silver front sight is only visible at the wedding band and not at the breech, where Roy likes to see the front sight with varying amounts of silver for different ranges.  
So the first job was to take off the little silver front sight, and install a "turtle" styled sight 5" back from the muzzle, according to his taste and preference.  Now the gun is going to shoot even lower, so the barrel obviously needs to be bent.  But this barrel is one stiff son-on-a-gun.  After many tries bending the barrel as much as I dared, it would spring right back to the same amount of deflection as before.  To measure the deflection, I laid a straight edge along the front sight and breech plug, and the ruler almost touched at the wedding ring.  I didn't measure it, because it meant breaking out drills smaller than #60.  But with lots of encouragement from Roy, I put a 12" wrench over the handle of the "C" clamp and wound it down until the barrel pressed hard to the bench.  I left it there and went and got my camera, and then took out the pup for a pee, and then came back, took the pictures, and released the pressure.  Finally, I got a tiny amount of bend into the tube - enough to allow a #48 drill to pass between the straight edge and the wedding band.  We'll shoot it like that, and see what happens.
this barrel has a crown and freur de lis stamped into the angle flat at the breech.  I've no idea where it was made, but it isn't 12L14!!!


D. Taylor Sapergia
www.sapergia.blogspot.com

Art is not an object.  It is the excitement inspired by the object.

Offline JDK

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Re: ..."make it shoot higher"
« Reply #1 on: June 29, 2011, 01:04:24 AM »
OH MY!!! :o  You are much braver than I.

J.D.K.
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Offline Hank*in*WV

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Re: ..."make it shoot higher"
« Reply #2 on: June 29, 2011, 01:29:23 AM »
Looks like your table might shoot a little lower.
"Much of the social history of the western world over the past three decades has involved replacing what worked with what sounded good. . ." Thomas Sowell

Offline D. Taylor Sapergia

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Re: ..."make it shoot higher"
« Reply #3 on: June 29, 2011, 01:31:23 AM »
I was just about to post something to that effect.  That's a 32" wide solid core door.  Check out the bend in the table.
D. Taylor Sapergia
www.sapergia.blogspot.com

Art is not an object.  It is the excitement inspired by the object.

Leatherbelly

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Re: ..."make it shoot higher"
« Reply #4 on: June 29, 2011, 01:40:15 AM »
   LOL! It looks like it could double as a truck spring.Man this barrel is made from strong material! It's an old /new barrel. When I received the gun the barrel was very very shiny like new inside. Judging by the frizzen, I don't think it had ever been shot. I'll have to ask Karl.The lock is an old style Davis Tvlle with an internal type blind frizzen screw.
  Does anyone know whose touch mark this is? A crown and fleur de lis on the flat at the breach. These are the only marks on the barrel.

Maybe Danny Caywood?
« Last Edit: June 29, 2011, 01:45:56 AM by CanvasBack »

Offline Telgan

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Re: ..."make it shoot higher"
« Reply #5 on: June 29, 2011, 01:52:39 AM »
Holy Cow!  Let us know how it turns out. Might shoot over the moon - But Probably Just Right.

Offline bob in the woods

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Re: ..."make it shoot higher"
« Reply #6 on: June 29, 2011, 01:59:59 AM »
Ya...done that.  I had a 2 x 3 on the bench and cranked a 13/16 . 36 cal all the way done to the bench to straighten it. Springy rascals !!   It is amazing how much you need to bend them in order to effect any change when the clamp is released.

Offline Luke MacGillie

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Re: ..."make it shoot higher"
« Reply #7 on: June 29, 2011, 02:39:38 AM »
Does anyone know whose touch mark this is? A crown and fleur de lis on the flat at the breach. These are the only marks on the barrel.

An early Centermark perhaps?

Offline smylee grouch

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Re: ..."make it shoot higher"
« Reply #8 on: June 29, 2011, 03:55:26 AM »
Wow, looks scarey. This might turn into a tutatorial if it works out. Best of luck on your endevor.    Smylee

Dave Faletti

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Re: ..."make it shoot higher"
« Reply #9 on: June 29, 2011, 04:27:44 AM »
I had that trouble with my fowler barrel.  Flexed it like that then it finally yielded and got more than I wanted.  It took a lot less force to bend it back most of the way to where I wanted it. 

Offline Don Getz

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Re: ..."make it shoot higher"
« Reply #10 on: June 29, 2011, 04:28:27 AM »
Luke.......you might be right there....Centermark.   I know this is the configuration of barrel that they used.    The octagon
section is straight and the round protion is a straight taper.   I think E. R. Shaw in Pittsburgh used to make the barrels for
them..................Don

Offline smart dog

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Re: ..."make it shoot higher"
« Reply #11 on: June 29, 2011, 04:54:02 AM »
Taylor, you are awesome!  It is a great to watch someone who knows what they are doing solve a problem like that.

dave
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Offline D. Taylor Sapergia

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Re: ..."make it shoot higher"
« Reply #12 on: June 29, 2011, 04:58:25 AM »
You wouldn't have said so if you'd be here when we did it!!  I was half expecting the thing to explode or snap at any time.  When I bent my 1st model
BB barrel, I just took it by the muzzle and slapped it into a tree until I got the bend that worked.  And did it ever!
D. Taylor Sapergia
www.sapergia.blogspot.com

Art is not an object.  It is the excitement inspired by the object.

Offline Acer Saccharum

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Re: ..."make it shoot higher"
« Reply #13 on: June 29, 2011, 05:19:41 AM »
If you try this on a barrel with dovetailed lugs, guess where the barrel will bend? (or crack?)

Tom
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Rasch Chronicles

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Re: ..."make it shoot higher"
« Reply #14 on: June 29, 2011, 05:54:09 AM »
Wow..

I actually shuddered when I saw the picture. Holy Smokes!

Acer, that's probably a good point too.

Best regards,
Albert “Yes, I am still in Afghanistan!” Rasch
The Rasch Outdoor Chronicles
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Online Tim Crosby

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Re: ..."make it shoot higher"
« Reply #15 on: June 29, 2011, 03:34:40 PM »
 

  Nerves of steel.

   Tim C.

Offline Mike T

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Re: ..."make it shoot higher"
« Reply #16 on: June 29, 2011, 03:53:25 PM »
Taylor,
          I have always wondered if you bend a barrel, will it return to its former shape after being subjected to the heat and stress of prolonged shooting or just with time.  I'm no expert on metals, but I wonder if a metal barrel has memory and stress releaves under certain conditions.  i know this will probably depend on the type of metal, amount of heat etc. and to what degree you flex it.  Has anyone had  any experience with this?
Mike T

Offline Roger Fisher

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Re: ..."make it shoot higher"
« Reply #17 on: June 29, 2011, 06:07:19 PM »

My Getz (are there any other kind) 28 gauge smooth barrel  had to be bent which I did with large clamps - blocks etc. Had to finally get postal and went 'farther' than I thought I should.  She ended up 'spot on' in lieu of 7 inches low at 4 o'clock at 30 yds.  The ol gal stayed there and she has served me well the last 10 or some such years. So, she didn't have a memory compared to some. :)

westerner

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Re: ..."make it shoot higher"
« Reply #18 on: June 29, 2011, 06:58:06 PM »
Looks like your table might shoot a little lower.

LMAO  ;D

 Joe.

Leatherbelly

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Re: ..."make it shoot higher"
« Reply #19 on: June 29, 2011, 09:55:53 PM »
  Just got off the phone with the fellow who bought my old Centremark fusil and he said he has the same touch marks as this NE fowler barrel. Different profile though. Thanks Don Getz and Mr. MacGillie. The New York Centermarks(Paul Siebert)has a different barrel again.
  Later today we'll see if this bend brings the shots up or not. If not, we'll bend it some more. Thanks all.

Offline Collector

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Re: ..."make it shoot higher"
« Reply #20 on: June 30, 2011, 01:05:29 AM »
Nobody wants to taper the upper octagon flats and file in a 'V' groove at the breech?  Looking at that bent barrel, under tension, screams (in my minds eye) for a less stressful (pun intended) solution. 

I look at those photos and get the same knot, in my stomach, as I would, watching someone with an unregulated pneumatic driver tightening threaded bolts connecting steel structural members.  Scary... but that's just me.

I wish all of the participants, in this endeavor, Good Luck.

Offline Ky-Flinter

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Re: ..."make it shoot higher"
« Reply #21 on: June 30, 2011, 01:26:20 AM »
Whooweee Taylor.  We're having some fun now.  Eh?  I had to do a similar operation on a 38" B-weight .50cal barrel a while back.  It was shooting waaaay to the left.  Had to "bend it straight" as Don Getz says.  My bench wasn't as stout as yours.  I used a long piece of square steel channel for my base.  It's plumb scary how far you have to bend a barrel to account for the spring back effect.

Oh, the barrel I bent straightened shoots center now.  I hope I never have to do that again!

-Ron
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LehighBrad

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Re: ..."make it shoot higher"
« Reply #22 on: June 30, 2011, 01:47:20 AM »
Wow!! :o Coolness!!! Let's see what else we can get him to bend!!!lol That sure ain't no Chinese made Harbor Freight C-clamp!! ;D

Offline Captchee

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Re: ..."make it shoot higher"
« Reply #23 on: June 30, 2011, 04:30:37 PM »
LOL , its not as bad as what it looks . I actually had a customer bring me a set of SXS barrel that looked like that  while setting in the stock. Some fool had told him that he could fire blue the barrels with a torch.
 Never did get those barrels back down 100% but we got close 
 
 I would also agree that it doesn’t take as much  as one would think . Its surprising how just a little bend can make a very big difference .
 the bend wont be noticable

KennyC

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Re: ..."make it shoot higher"
« Reply #24 on: June 30, 2011, 09:51:10 PM »
Saw that done twice between a couple of trees I nearly barfed watching them bend to get by spring point. The first one shot better afer they were done . That a guy watching let strangers do the same to his. I can't see doing that to my tulle I learned where it shoots and delt with it.