Kiln dried vs air dried

[Jerry V Lape]

If you want some air dried wood ready pretty quickly for use, send it down here to Arizona.  I put it in the attic for about 6 months and send it back.  It will be air dried.  Might as well kiln dry it though as most kilns probably don't get as hot as my back patio in June-Sept, nor as dry as it has been for the last month.  We were less than 1% humidity for several days last month. 

[Kermit]

The problem with either type of drying usually comes from speed. Lots of kiln dried stuff is cooked so fast that the wood is damaged. Lots of air dried stuff isn't dried long enough, so it's not dry enough. Someone said something about "properly" dried wood. If either process isn't done right, you've got firewood, IMHO.

I air dry outdoors, covered, stickered, in the shade, one year per inch of thickness. Then I move it into the shop for a year or two to stabillze.

That's why I don't do it much, and buy my hardwoods, and then hope. I've been wrong and had expensive furniture land back in my shop.

[northmn]

Jerry brought up a point as to drying and time.  The old one year to an inch is a standard but where?  As he stated, in Arizona, you might get a stock blank in six months.  Bowyers use a moisture meter, which is the only way to determine for sure at what moisture your blank is at.  The meters cost about $150.  I just put a maple blank in my unheated garage with painted ends and it split badly.  This was cut in September when it hasn't been particularly hot.  Generally when home cutting you win some and lose some.  There is no drying method that is foolproof and some of the originals and some of the commercial stocks have had flaws.  Wood is not a stable material like steel.

DP

[Trkdriver99]

Gentlemen,
I really do thank you for all the answers to this enquiry. I have learned that some of the answers are personal choice, but that both methods if done correctly will work. I think that I have learned from this. Again I thank everyone.
Ronnie

[Dphariss]

Jerry brought up a point as to drying and time.  The old one year to an inch is a standard but where?  As he stated, in Arizona, you might get a stock blank in six months.  Bowyers use a moisture meter, which is the only way to determine for sure at what moisture your blank is at.  The meters cost about $150.  I just put a maple blank in my unheated garage with painted ends and it split badly.  This was cut in September when it hasn't been particularly hot.  Generally when home cutting you win some and lose some.  There is no drying method that is foolproof and some of the originals and some of the commercial stocks have had flaws.  Wood is not a stable material like steel.

DP

It certainly is not stable.
But I KNOW that relying on moisture content will not indicate a stable piece of wood.
Some wood will split as it drys. The tree may have been damaged at some time. When it was cut or years before in a wind storm etc. Weird grain flow will promote checks.
As I stated before age, assuming the wood has been inside out of the weather, is more important than moisture content. New wood 1-3 years old with a good moisture content is FAR less reliable than 5-10 YO wood with the same moisture content I don't care what locale it drys in.
I have seen blanks that tested good for moisture that would lose fit in a week when made into stocks.
Did not warp, did not split. The inletting just opened up in places or they shrank away from the buttplate etc. This is not something a bowyer is likely to run into.
If the stock maker wants a GOOD result on a high end gun he needs to use aged wood.
It is possible to make a stock from "new" wood and have good results. But it is preferable to have the "ready to use" stock in the shop of at least a year after its purchased to assure that the wood has normalized (more normalized???).
Dan

[Kermit]

  I know moisture meters are almost as popular as cell phones, but I don't trust 'em. All I have to think about is that there are those two little prongy things that get stuck into the wood. Then, I presume, the thing measures the relative electgrical conductivity of the wood, inferring from that the amount of H2O in the wood between the prongs. My problem comes in that the meter is measuring the moisture content only between the two prongs and at a depth no more that you just stuck the thing into the wood. Seems to me a wild guess couched in what appears to be science.

But I could be wrong...

[Acer Saccharum]

Though I don't recommend it, I once made a gun from green wood, with water just about dripping out of the plank. This was my first gun ever, and it worked. I think by the time the gun was finished, the wood was fairly dry. It was maple. I can't remember how the inleting was though

Acer

[northmn]

Bowyers swear by the meters and use them.  A good self bow ideally is at about 9% which permits bending without breaking or taking set.  I assume they take several readings.  Gunstocks are really not that critical.  Some determine dryness by weight loss.  Weighing the blank at obvious green and then at what might be dry.  Others like myself just kind of go by looks and feel.  My last gun I kind of rushed because everyone wanted to tell the method would not work.  But to add to Acer's comment.  The wood does dry while you shave things down.  I put the gun in the hotbox a couple of times due to the way the wood was working.  Green wood does not break of with chisel work like dry wood and acts a little stringy.  Biggest problem I ahd was swelling after the wood dried as I had a basement shop that would get a little humid at times.  Hotbox would take that out as will putting a stock in a car. 

DP

[westbj2]

If the stock maker wants a GOOD result on a high end gun he needs to use aged wood.

Good advice.  The University of Wisconsin at Madison had (and may still have) a wood research laboratory.  They were able to date within +/- 10 years of when a tree was cut.  I once sent them a piece of wood from an Alexander Henry match rifle for analysis.  They determined that the tree was cut about 1830.  The rifle dated from 1863.

I had a customer who made custom violin bows.  These bows went to musicians in some of the best philharmonic orchestras.  One day he came into the shop with a piece of wood for a new bow that he had just received from a supplier in Italy.
The supplier had been in business under the same name for almost 200 years supplying wood to the instrument trade.   The piece was about 2" square and 30" or so long and it was SERIALIZED with a 5 digit number.  The number certified that the tree from which it came was harvested in 1908.  Violin bows must be stable to keep a consistent tone!!

Ledgers in the Manton book reveal that only barrels were more expensive than stockblanks in terms of gun components.  There is no reason not to think that wood dealers were catering to the gun trade as well as the musical trade for those willing to pay a premium for aged wood. 

It is a good bet that when you look at a 18th or 19th century London 'best' gun still in crisp condition, the flawless fit is due in large part to the stability of the wood.

The trick today is finding and being able to afford the old wood.

Jim Westberg

[G. Elsenbeck]

I think I heard something one time that kiln dried walnut will lose some of its color and that it sometimes has to be steamed to get the nice color to return.   

Actually its the other way around.  Kiln dried walnut, when done properly, will retain its color.  It is only when the wood is steamed dried does it lose all that great color.  Why do they do this you ask?  To maximize the yield from the tree.  Steaming 'balances the color out' and helps make the heartwood blend better with the sap wood resulting in a more even staining process.  As one who has worked with walnut for the past 30 years or so it seems its getting harder and harder to get either the good 'air dried' or properly kiln dried product.  It's really the fault of the big furniture manufactures that have driven this latest 'inovation'.

[crispy]

I've only built one stock so far,, and I am not a cabinet maker ,,, two winters ago I took a curly maple plank ,, not sure if it was kiln or air dried,, and with hand tools I slowly made it into a tulle stock,, I sure found out fast just how much wood can take a bend when it gets thin ,, I found that I had to keep it clamped to prevent it from taking a bend ,, it was prob a combination of the grain pattern in the wood , and the newly cut  wood being exposed to the air in my basement ,, after all was done it eventually stopped trying to change shape , and I ended up with a stock that I like .  I'm thinking that kiln or air dried differences will not be the same for any two species of wood so you cant generalize ,,, just work with what you got .

[Stophel]

I age all my stocks at least a year before use....Ok, that means that they're all propped up in the corner of the room sitting around waiting for me to use them.