Author Topic: Crisco for hunting patch lube  (Read 19634 times)

FRJ

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Re: Crisco for hunting patch lube
« Reply #25 on: September 24, 2011, 10:01:36 PM »
Roundball, yes that is very confusing. I am shooting one shot a day from a clean barre. Prior to this I have shot more than one shot and by the third the barrel is so fouled that I either  have  to hammer the ball down or clean the barrel. I didn't understand what was happening till I read about the fouling here on this site. The accuracy has also gone down hill with the crisco as lube as I am shooting the same target each day and I can see the differencein the spread with  the crisco. This rifle shoots one hole groups at 50 yards with WSW fluid.I got my mink oil in the mail yesterday so Im going out in a few minutes and try it out. The rifle has been loaded for three days now so I have to shoot that load and then start a new target. I'll report when I get home. Frank

Leatherbelly

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Re: Crisco for hunting patch lube
« Reply #26 on: September 24, 2011, 11:44:32 PM »
  When someone mentions Crisco, I'm always somewhat confused. Are you guys talking about the "lard" type of shortening or the bottled liquid oil?

Daryl

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Re: Crisco for hunting patch lube
« Reply #27 on: September 25, 2011, 12:12:09 AM »
  When someone mentions Crisco, I'm always somewhat confused. Are you guys talking about the "lard" type of shortening or the bottled liquid oil?

Years ago when it seemed a lot of people were using crisco, it was the shortening. It is the shortening that brown bear was filling the cap and ball cylinder with, over the balls to prevent cross-firing of the chambers and that's what coated the hood of his truck.

I made mention of the oil as well, as neither worked, for me as a hunting lube.

FRJ

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Re: Crisco for hunting patch lube
« Reply #28 on: September 25, 2011, 04:40:44 AM »
Now I'm really in trouble. I thought changing over to  a hunting load would just be a change of lube and maybe a slight sight adj. My rifle that was a tack driver is now shooting more like a shotgun. I got my mink oil from track yesterday and went out to try it today and so help me God its as bad as the Crisco was. Second shot is hard to get down and 3rd I need a hammer on. Balls are hitting all over the place and I've got my rear sight adjusted all the way to the right. Worst thing is I start a week of Jury duty next week and my elk season starts the Sunday right after that.I dont know what to do. I went up to 100 gr 2f from 90 and that did nothing good.I dont mind the fouling except that I thought the Track mink oil wasn't supposed to do that. I'm going back down to 90 gr and back to Crisco and hope I get time  to run out and check zero after jury duty some day next week.Pray for me. Frank

catman

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Re: Crisco for hunting patch lube
« Reply #29 on: September 25, 2011, 07:01:09 AM »
Try Birdgog6 lube, I don't use anything else..

http://www.custommuzzleloaders.com/grease.html

BrownBear

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Re: Crisco for hunting patch lube
« Reply #30 on: September 25, 2011, 07:19:20 AM »
My can is about a year old and half gone.  I shot again today with two other 58's too, rifles that have liked it in the past.  They still like it just fine, while the recent acquisition still hates it.

Now you have me wondering with your description of accuracy deterioration, and I'm going to try something.  In the past when I ran into either sudden accuracy problems or a change in fouling it proved to be accumulation in the bore not removed by my normal cleaning.  That was especially true back the days of "conditioning" the bore with Bore Butter or Wonder Lube.  I've been assuming this rifle was shot very little if at all, but now I wonder.

In any case, the past solution was a really thorough bore cleaning to remove any accumulated residue.  The best I've found for the job is a little brake pad cleaner on a succession of patches.  It takes the bore back to bright condition and sure solved the problem.  I hear the same for carburetor cleaner.

Daryl

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Re: Crisco for hunting patch lube
« Reply #31 on: September 25, 2011, 07:21:55 PM »
Don't know what the problem is Frank - I've never had a buildup of anything in my bores since about 1975, when I found I needed a thicker patch and one that is WET with lube.  I've not used bore butter enough to have a buildup so the buildup I am referring to was fouling. With thicker, wet patches, there has been no buildup of anything.

When someone says their accuracy just went terrible with a simple change and increasing the powder charge didn't fix it, something else is wrong. Perhaps it is a buildup of something in the bore. Try brownbear's brake-pad cleaner and re-try the mink oil - or Neetsfoot oil. They both work for me.

I use balls .005" or .006" under bore size, 10oz. denim or .0221" to .025" ticking nowadays depending on what I've got patches cut from for the calibre I'm wanting to use.

Leatherbelly

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Re: Crisco for hunting patch lube
« Reply #32 on: September 25, 2011, 08:00:31 PM »
  Frank,
    Maybe too thin a patch? I shoot much the same as Daryl mentions.5 thou under ball size, 20 thou patch.My fifty likes it!

Daryl

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Re: Crisco for hunting patch lube
« Reply #33 on: September 25, 2011, 09:09:26 PM »
In addition to LB's comment, there is no such thing as a .50 that won't shoot that combination.  The same ratio in combination shoots in all calibre guns and barrels I've tested as well.  It is possible an exceptionally deep rifling barrel will require a different recipe, but normal barrels most of us use, shoot it - even those production rifles with .004"deep(shallow) button'd rifling like the combination. The crown's shape allows this loading even in those of button rifled shallow grooves.

Sorry if this is deemed off topic.
« Last Edit: September 26, 2011, 01:23:41 AM by Daryl »

BrownBear

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Re: Crisco for hunting patch lube
« Reply #34 on: September 25, 2011, 10:50:39 PM »
Quick followup:

Brake pad cleaner wins the day.  I went 12 straight shots with TOW mink grease in the offending 58 with no apparent crud ring.  Switched to Crisco for 6 shots, same. Tried 6 with my homebrew lube (3:1 tallow:olive oil), same.  Back to the mink grease for another 12, same.  I did no swabbing along the way.

Whatever was going on down there in the bottom of the bore, the thorough cleaning fixed it.  My guess is some kind of accumulation had survived past cleanings, however the previous owner was doing it.  Color me happy.
« Last Edit: September 25, 2011, 10:51:18 PM by BrownBear »

Leatherbelly

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Re: Crisco for hunting patch lube
« Reply #35 on: September 26, 2011, 01:19:30 AM »
 not arguing.

Offline kutter

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Re: Crisco for hunting patch lube
« Reply #36 on: September 26, 2011, 01:51:24 AM »
I mix crisco and bore-butter 50/50. I melt them together in a shoe polish tin for convenient carry and use.
I just eyeball the 50/50 thing.
A  few quick sweeps underneath the tin with a propane torch while holding it with a pliers melts the two easily.
A quick stir and let it cool on the vise flat.

I've shot up to 35rds in my 50cal FL (490 ball, .020 denim patch) in one session with never wiping the bore. No problems at all with fouling. Could have shot more,,just ran out of sunlight.
I'm not stingy when lubing the patch. But not sloppy about it either. A nice even coating rubbed into the denim.
Good accuracy, not that I'm a great rifle shooter. 2" @ 50m if I'm carefull. I think the gun can do better if I experimented more but I just like plinking with it.

I admit I am a returnee to the sport at a late age. But early experiences with straight crisco left much to be desired as I recalled both in RB and musket.
BoreButter by itself was OK in my recent tries, but gave some fouling problems after 5 or 6 shots. Plus it is a little too thin for my liking. I actually started mixing it with the crisco just to thicken it up some. It would have been beeswax but I couldn't find my stash from 40yrs ago!

Just my limited experiences.

FRJ

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Re: Crisco for hunting patch lube
« Reply #37 on: September 29, 2011, 02:25:16 AM »
I went out yesterday and tried it all over again. I believe  what was happening is that even though I was cleaning the bore with cold water and a little dishwashing soap till my patches came out spotlessly clean there was still a residue of crisco in the pores of the barrel steel. After repeated cleanings between shots and then upping the powder charge from 90gr 2f to 110 gr 2f I'm getting much smoother  loading without having to use a hammer or excessive force.The groups went from 4" at 50yards to ball holes touching in the center of the bull at 50yards. If I don't have jury duty tomorrow I'll be going out early in the AM and checking out the load and my elk hunting spots. Wish me luck and thanks for all the help so far. Frank

Daryl

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Re: Crisco for hunting patch lube
« Reply #38 on: September 29, 2011, 03:21:14 AM »
Good luck Frank - sounds like you've got it figured out.

AmBraCol

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Re: Crisco for hunting patch lube
« Reply #39 on: September 29, 2011, 05:48:45 AM »
I'm glad you got it figured out.  When I got back into shooting roundball after years away from it I decided to go "old fashioned" and use natural lube in the form of tallow.  I'm shooting a CVA "Kentucky" in 45 and was getting a lot of fouling which made seating the ball a chore after a few shots.  Then I went to olive oil (no mix, straight oil, applied just prior to loading) and no more dry fouling.  The last shot loads as easy as the first, no wiping between shots. 

What purpose would be served by mixing beeswax with the olive oil?  I shy away from Crisco and other such vegetable oils after seeing how gummy they make surfaces over time. So far I've been happy with just plain olive oil.

Daryl

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Re: Crisco for hunting patch lube
« Reply #40 on: September 29, 2011, 08:30:55 PM »
Has anone used this liquid Hornady One Shot cleaner as a range patch lube? I am not interested in anything that comes in a tube.  I have some Senendoah lube to try next time out - should do that today, shouldn't I. OK - I'm off top the range.


Greyfeather

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Re: Crisco for hunting patch lube
« Reply #41 on: September 29, 2011, 09:28:09 PM »
I'm really interested in hearing about your evaluation of the Shenandoah lube. I haven't tried the Hornady One Shot cleaner,so can't add anything there. Presently I am using Jojoba oil and can shoot all afternoon without swabbing between shoots in my hunting loads.
John

Daryl

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Re: Crisco for hunting patch lube
« Reply #42 on: September 29, 2011, 11:27:37 PM »
Sounds good John - sorry, nothing to report yet. I got out to the range and it was blowing a gale out there - and now, it's windy in town too. Maybe tomorrow if it doesn't rain.

FRJ

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Re: Crisco for hunting patch lube
« Reply #43 on: September 30, 2011, 01:25:17 AM »
Well I went out today and tried the TOW mink oil again. First shot dead center in the bull, the next 4 went around or touching the first for a group about 3/4" at 50 yards. Started having trouble raming the ball home on the third shot and very difficult on  the fifth but all shot really well. Sixth shot went 5" high and 2" left. It was very difficult to load. I think there must be Crisco in the pores of the steel that is slowly coming out. The rifle gets easier to load after each cleaning so I'm preety sure the problem was the crisco. Final load data is: 110 gr 2f, felt overpowder wad,535dia hornady ball wrapped in 18thou blue stripped pillow ticking with a heavy load of TOW mink oil as a lube. CCI #11 mag primer. The rifle is a Lyman GPR 54 cal. It was shot off a bench with Caldwell front and rear rests. My left eye, the one I sight with had a stroke in it a couple years ago so my sight is 1/2 gone and blurry. I'm sure the rifle would shoot better with a different set of eyes. This will be my elk load as I'm very confident in its ability to work for me. Scouted elk today and it only looks fair but all I need is one shot. The rifle will work hope I can say the same for me. Frank

Daryl

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Re: Crisco for hunting patch lube
« Reply #44 on: September 30, 2011, 03:02:21 AM »
Seems to be working, Frank - keep us posted. Good luck on the Elk.

FRJ

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Re: Crisco for hunting patch lube
« Reply #45 on: September 30, 2011, 10:47:49 PM »
I'm sorry I was very rude and didn't thank everyone that helped me on this project!!!!  A BIG Thank You to each and every one of you for all the help you have given me on this and other projects. This is a wonderful forum with a lot of very nice people on it. Hang on though as I'm about to start on my first build and will have lots of questions. Frank

Offline Leatherbark

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Re: Crisco for hunting patch lube
« Reply #46 on: October 24, 2011, 01:02:36 AM »
Has anone used this liquid Hornady One Shot cleaner as a range patch lube? I am not interested in anything that comes in a tube.  I have some Senendoah lube to try next time out - should do that today, shouldn't I. OK - I'm off top the range.




I've used a bottle of it for range use and cleaning for the last two years. No complaints that I can pinpoint. Won our recent silohuette match last month with patches lubed with this stuff. Havent checked for rust as I oil the bore well after cleaning. It is an oily type of watery lube that smells like LHV and Shennendoa. Sort of "Lestiol" like.  I suspect it is the same as Shennendoa.

Bob

Daryl

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Re: Crisco for hunting patch lube
« Reply #47 on: October 24, 2011, 03:06:33 AM »
Those were my suspicions as well, Bob.  I did try the Shenedoah lube in my old .45 that liked 75gr. 3f with LHV, a .022" patch and .445" ball.  It shot the same with the Shenendoah lube as it always did before with LHV. They all pretty much smell the same due to the pine oil, I guess.
« Last Edit: October 24, 2011, 03:13:56 AM by Daryl »