tin

[frenchman]

 all the balls, maxi's, minie's i use pure lead so what to do with tin, i have over 10 lbs of it

[hanshi]

Sell or trade it for (lots) more pure lead....unless you also cast for cartridges.

[frenchman]

not very popular around here but will try thanks

[camerl2009]

if you add a bit of tin to your lead it will have better fill out

something like 40 to 1 lead/tin witch is 97.5% lead and 2.5% tin this alloy is only 7 bhn pure lead is 5 bhn

[Daryl]

40:1 lead to tin is generally too hard for round balls that are properly sized to fit a barrel, ie: .005" under bore size - or larger.  40:1 is a mix used by some BP ctg. shooters, while others use 30:1 or 20:1.

[camerl2009]

40:1 lead to tin is generally too hard for round balls that are properly sized to fit a barrel, ie: .005" under bore size - or larger.  40:1 is a mix used by some BP ctg. shooters, while others use 30:1 or 20:1.

i use 20:1 in my BPCR  i dont think 40:1 would be too hard at all since you will find that must scrap you have that you call pure is really about 5-7 bhn while pure virgin lead is 5

while 40:1 is any where from 7-8 bhn

pure virgin tin is 7 bhn

fact is you need some tin even some thing like a 60:1 would work better then pure lead for fill out


id keep the tin even if you dont plan on using it its rare to find near pure tin in scrap and right now at roto metals its 17.50 a pound

[Daryl]

whatever

[Harnic]

It would seem to me anyone feeling they need tin to fill out a roundball mold is not getting the lead & mold hot enough.  I've never seen the need to use tin in any muzzle loading rifle.  I agree with Daryl that adding tin is not a good idea if your ball/patch combo is the correct size.

[BrownBear]

I use 50:50 tin bar solder for concocting Lyman #2 alloy(90% lead/5% tin/5% Antimony for BHN 15) in my cartridge guns, and it's dandy.  I wasn't paying attention one time and used some to cast RBs.  Not. 

They would have been dandy to limit expansion for more penetration on moose or elk if I wanted, but with an attendant change in patches due to diameter changes.  I use pure lead for all my balls simply because I don't want to keep track of yet another "sub-variation" of ball diameters rattling around my shop.

[hanshi]

It looks like your best choice is to just to get rid of it by sending it to me.  I'll give it a good home.

[Daryl]

I have a 'batch' of pure lead form the walls of an x-ray room. It's dead soft & dirty - to the point that when melting it, it turns blue pluss the other colours before being completely molten and remains those colours when cooling, skiming constantly, until the lead cannot be scooped. Because it came from an X-ray room, it has to be pure - what is causing those nasty colours and rapid oxidation, I don't know.  Bring to temp, and skim it, and within 20 balls (I cast fast, too) it is developing a hard chunky on top - oxidation. This happens so quickly, I could not cast (dipping) 25 to 28 balls before I was getting inclusions in the balls.

I discovered, that if I dipped 1/4" of 50/50 bar solder into the 20 pound pot, then immediatly fluxed, I could cast 50 to 100 balls depending on size, before fluxing and skimming was necessary again.  Thus, with THIS pure lead, I have to add tin- I would expect the 1/4" of 50/50 might add something like a 99.5:1 mix - or maybe thinner, but it is enough to help the casting time. The balls are still dead soft.  I've never run into this with any other pure lead I've used - many hundreds of pounds of it well before 1985. I don't know exactly as I've never kept track, but it's a lot.

During the 1970's I used to pick up pure lead at the telphone company sevral times a year in 300 pound lots in the trunk of my Pol. Car. It all went out the muzzles of muzzleloaders as I was shooting straight WW in pistols and rifles at that time, not tin/lead.

Tin is valuable commodity to bullet casters, especially with bp ctg. shooters. I fond it aided my pure lead ball casting, not to fill out the moulds, but to allow casting time.

[camerl2009]

I have a 'batch' of pure lead form the walls of an x-ray room. It's dead soft & dirty - to the point that when melting it, it turns blue pluss the other colours before being completely molten and remains those colours when cooling, skiming constantly, until the lead cannot be scooped. Because it came from an X-ray room, it has to be pure - what is causing those nasty colours and rapid oxidation, I don't know.  Bring to temp, and skim it, and within 20 balls (I cast fast, too) it is developing a hard chunky on top - oxidation. This happens so quickly, I could not cast (dipping) 25 to 28 balls before I was getting inclusions in the balls.

I discovered, that if I dipped 1/4" of 50/50 bar solder into the 20 pound pot, then immediatly fluxed, I could cast 50 to 100 balls depending on size, before fluxing and skimming was necessary again.  Thus, with THIS pure lead, I have to add tin- I would expect the 1/4" of 50/50 might add something like a 99.5:1 mix - or maybe thinner, but it is enough to help the casting time. The balls are still dead soft.  I've never run into this with any other pure lead I've used - many hundreds of pounds of it well before 1985. I don't know exactly as I've never kept track, but it's a lot.

During the 1970's I used to pick up pure lead at the telphone company sevral times a year in 300 pound lots in the trunk of my Pol. Car. It all went out the muzzles of muzzleloaders as I was shooting straight WW in pistols and rifles at that time, not tin/lead.

Tin is valuable commodity to bullet casters, especially with bp ctg. shooters. I fond it aided my pure lead ball casting, not to fill out the moulds, but to allow casting time.

keep the temp low with pure or it will turn color like that and oxidize  when i cast pure lead i use about 4 on my lee pot i also smelt it down clean it and cast into ingots before i ever put it into my melting pot

i get my soft lead from a guy who works at bell i dont know what thay use it for but its in a big tube like form when i get it with about 5lb end caps made of lead (most of it was hacked up with some sort of saw before i got my hands on it)

[Habu]

Daryl, I'm not sure what it is about xray-shielding lead--possibly a surface treatment of some kind--but I had a similar observation back when I had a commercial bullet-casting operation.  The only way I found to deal with it was to smelt it in large lots and flux the bejeebers out of it several times, then flux frequently while casting.  I never had a problem quite like that with any other lead source. 

[b bogart]

I think you'll find that xray lead shield that is peeled from the back of drywall has adhesive residue that is difficult to clean off, about the only way is to melt and flux, and take alot of nasty $#@* off the initial melt. The sheild that is not attached to the drywall probably has some kind of coating to ward off oxidation. I use a bunch of it because in my previous employment I had availability to a couple hundred pounds of it. Free is good!

[Kermit]

I put 1oz of 50/50 bar solder to 5lb lead. Have for 3-4 decades now. Anecdotal, I know, but I seem to get better fillout and more consistent weight.

[Daryl]

Kermit, that's 160:1 mix an will still be VERY soft. I am perhaps using about the same 1oz, but in 20 pounds. It allows easier, longer casting sessions with the sheeting. Pure lead requires a setting around 7.5 on my pot to cast perfect balls, from the first to the last one cast. Unless I screw up, each and every one is perfectly formed, bright and shiny, like pearls, no discolouration, no wrinkles, no inclusions, no defects.




Telephone companies which used to be a good source for pure lead, no longer use lead on the lines - it's all plastic & epoxy casings now, has been for probably 15 years of more - as far as I was informed by 'then' BC Tel lineman.

[camerl2009]

i dont think this lead was wraped around the lines i think it was somthing on a pole it does have grease on it

[frenchman]

well i guest i shall use the stuff just cut it 1/2 an ounce for my lee 10 pounder, will be trying this lead on a 36 mold that i am ordering

[Dphariss]

40:1 lead to tin is generally too hard for round balls that are properly sized to fit a barrel, ie: .005" under bore size - or larger.  40:1 is a mix used by some BP ctg. shooters, while others use 30:1 or 20:1.

i use 20:1 in my BPCR  i dont think 40:1 would be too hard at all since you will find that must scrap you have that you call pure is really about 5-7 bhn while pure virgin lead is 5

while 40:1 is any where from 7-8 bhn

pure virgin tin is 7 bhn

fact is you need some tin even some thing like a 60:1 would work better then pure lead for fill out


id keep the tin even if you dont plan on using it its rare to find near pure tin in scrap and right now at roto metals its 17.50 a pound

40:1 may result in a slightly larger ball and this could result in it loading harder. 40:1 will cast at a significantly lower temp and/or will pour much better than pure lead. How it will load is a function of the land/groove ratio in many cases.
I would have to look this up to be sure and really am not that interested.

Dan