German Silver Question

[gibster]

I have an original half stock rifle that is mounted in German Silver and all the hardware has a nice mellow look to it, not real shiny.  It is missing the nose cap and entry thimble and planned on replacing them.  I will have to make the entry thimble, but that shouldn't be a problem.  However, the only sheet silver I can find is labeled as Nickle Silver.  Is this different from German Silver?  Is there a way to get the coloration of new German Silver hardware to reasonably match the original hardware on the rifle?  With brass, it's not that difficult, but I have never worked with German Silver before.  Thanks for your help.

[welafong1]

i might be Wong but here goes German silver. nickle silver. and cooper nickel.l are the same thing there are two types depending on the amount of Copper in it like i said i might be wong check out a bamboo rod building forum they should know they use it in making rod handle butt caps
Richard Westerfield

[docone]

Nickle silver, german silver, same stuff, pretty much. They are copper alloys, same a brass, copper, german silver.
You should get the same colour on polish.

[louieparker]

Gibster,

Supposedly the name changed during WW2 , As German was not to popular .. But in my opinion there is a difference in the old and the new ..I don't know the difference in the make  up but seems the old has a different look ..I have gone to junk stores and bought old silver plated trays that date in the twenties and thirties for the metal  ..At the time I convinced myself it looked better ??     But give it the Knife test when no one is looking as some are  brass ..LP

[Shreckmeister]

I've seen variations of German silver that don't appear to be related to their aging or oxidation.  I would
imagine that you could have varying compositions of the elements.  Since this stuff doesn't oxidize
much. I would look for a piece with matching coloration.

[squire]

The German Silver hardware on my old fly rods, some of them quite old, has taken on a very mellow appearance which I would call patina rather than tarnish.  Perhaps one of the restoration experts on the bamboo rod building boards could offer some tips on making the new match the old.

[tuffy]

German silver

The Columbia Encyclopedia, Sixth Edition | 2008

"German silver name for various alloys of copper, zinc, and nickel, sometimes also containing lead and tin. They were originally named for their silver-white color, but use of the term silver is now prohibited for alloys not containing that metal. German silver varies in composition, the percentage of the three elements ranging approximately as follows: copper, from 50% to 61.6%; zinc, from 19% to 17.2%; nickel, from 30% to 21.1%. The proportions are always specified in commercial alloys. German silver is extensively used because of its hardness, toughness, and resistance to corrosion for articles such as tableware (commonly silver plated), marine fittings, and plumbing fixtures. Because of its high electrical resistance it is used also in heating coils. It was discovered (early 19th cent.) by a German industrial chemist, E. A. Geitner."

As you can see there is no silver in German Silver. It is pretty hard stuff depending on the amount of nickel in the mix. 

              CW

[JCKelly]

German Silver and Nickel Silver are slightly different alloys of Copper, Nickel, and Zinc. The old German silver, in theory still made but I don't know who sells it, has more of a yellowish cast, the Nickel Silver available today is whiter.
The degree of whiteness comes mostly from the nickel content of the alloy, and to a lesser degree from the zinc.
Yeah, it is hard to matchold German Silver with what is commonly available today.

From a little unpublished work of mine, Gun Metals:
The most commonly available “German” silver alloy available today is called, variously, Nickel silver 65-18, or 18%—alloy A. The UNS number for this grade is C75200. Nominal chemistry is 65% copper, 18% nickel and 18% zinc. It has a silver-white color. The whiteness in nickel silver comes mostly from the nickel content, and to a lesser degree from zinc. I have observed that the alloy used on old American rifles has a more yellowish cast than seen with modern alloy.
There are many “nickel silver” alloys listed today. One current alloy which is actually tradenamed German silver, rather than Nickel silver, is 65% copper 12% nickel and 23% zinc. UNS C75700. Because of lower nickel, this grade may be expected to be somewhat less white in color than the 65-18 alloy. By comparison it appears yellowish. This matters when one attempts to repair an inlay on an old rifle, and exact color match becomes important.
The German silver trim on the sheath of this (my, not shown here) old Bowie knife, marked NON•XLL Joseph Allen & Sons, Sheffield is 61% copper 24% zinc 14% nickel, with assorted residuals. This metal has a yellowish cast, which is not matched by the new sheet of nickel silver in my shop.

[gibster]

Thanks for all the info.  The German Silver on the rifle has a yellowish cast to it like JCKelly said.  Looks like I will have my work cut out for me to get the new to match the old.  Maybe soaking in coffee grounds or tea may stain it .  I'll let you know how it goes.

[john schippers]

take your finished German silver part and hang it out side in the wether and by next spring it will mellow out and match old looking German silver. Lat the acid Raine do the job.