Author Topic: Round barrel wall gun help (Read 8535 times)

J Shingler · « **on:** November 18, 2008, 06:07:45 AM »

OK Guys
I need the wisdom of this great list. I have run up on something that I am a bit out of my realm. I am OK and can get myself out of most troubled spots when it comes to an octagon front stuffer but this here round barrel has gotten me stumped. You see my curiosity has gotten me into a tight spot. A good friend got these parts from the rifle shop. Don't know how or how long they were ordered. Peaked my curiosity just enough for me to agree to build it up for him. It is a 4 bore wall gun. Looks like a Brown Bess smoothbore on steroids. As you can see from the pictures I know I need to pull the barrel back but what kind or proportions do I go about making that flat spot to butt the lock up to?

1) As you can see it looks like the lock needs to go in a bit more, but the barrel fits although tightly in the precarved mortise. If I make a tapered flat area for the lock I am sure to have a wood gap. Maybe a stock error that I could splice in a sliver of wood if I had to.

2) Or has there ever been a solid step or notch filed out for the lock bolster. This would leave a better wood to barrel fit if this is proper.

I started filing but stopped before I went to far with the tapered flat area. Just not sure how to proceed. With the lock set in to full depth of the precarved lock mortise it appears I will need to flat spot the barrel about .080

What be the wisdom of the board for these big round barrels?

Acer Saccharum · « **Reply #1 on:** November 18, 2008, 06:33:56 AM »

Barrel should have been flatted before being inlet. @!*%. i hate precarves.

I like your stepped flat idea.

Acer

oh, excellent photography, by the way!

Dphariss · « **Reply #2 on:** November 18, 2008, 05:11:14 PM »

I hate them (full round barrels).
Carefully file the lock plate bolster this will help the fit as well.
I would make the flat just big enough to let the lock set tight to the barrel.
Precarves are a blessing (sometimes) but are oftn a curse so far as quality work is concerned.
It is critical that the man that cuts them has a proper pattern, a good machine and the motivation to make it right, and a little tight in the fit everywhere.
Dan

Mike Brooks · « **Reply #3 on:** November 18, 2008, 06:26:11 PM »

Jeff,
That barrel is going to have to be set back some. As it is now your touch hole is going to go right into the breech plug. Go ahead and file a flat on the barrel big enough so the lock plate will lie flat against it....your flat may end up to be 3/8" wide or so when you're done. You'll end up having to inlett the lock a bit deeper than what the precarve already probably has allowed for.I've built one of these, but opted to build it from a blank to avoid any of these precarved problems that come from using an original gun as a pattern.
Here's the one I did , I'm not sure if the pictures will help or not.
http://www.fowlingguns.com/militarygun4.html

Ezra · « **Reply #4 on:** November 18, 2008, 07:12:47 PM »

Yoiks!!!

That is one big rifle Mike. I'll bet it was a joy to shoot...

Loren

J.D. · « **Reply #5 on:** November 18, 2008, 10:45:53 PM »

Dang Jeff, that is some project you have there. Do you have a Pedersoli Bess to look at, for reference. Mine has a flat nearly 3/8 of an inch wide tapering to round near the front of the lock. I suspect that barrel will need a larger flat for the bolster of the lock to mate up to.

Like any good project, I suspect this one will get a lot of fitting and trying. And some of these projects require more trying than fitting.

Be sure to post photos of the finished gun. I gotta see a video of you test firing this beast once it is finished.

Good luck,
John

Roy S. · « **Reply #6 on:** November 19, 2008, 02:04:38 AM »

what Mr. Brooks said...

ddeaton · « **Reply #7 on:** November 19, 2008, 03:39:33 AM »

Original wall gun pics, not too clear though

ddeaton · « **Reply #8 on:** November 19, 2008, 03:41:52 AM »

More pics of a repo, I can take lock out and take a couple shots if you like

J Shingler · « **Reply #9 on:** November 19, 2008, 06:27:30 AM »

Hey guys.
Yea the barrel needs to be moved back but I would think that the lock flat would need to be filed on first to have the correct width of inlet of at least the part I do. Sure wish that wood was not allowing that barrel to drop in at the breach area.

Acer, thanks for the compliment on the photo. Just a snapshot with a good camera but I do like nice clear photos. Ever seen an original with a stepped lock bolster area? That would eliminate the gap that will sure to be there if I file a long tapered flat on the side of the barrel.

ddeaton pics with the lock removed would be great! If it is not a problem It would sure help.

Mike yea the precarve is more of a challenge. I would rather build it from a blank too. After Fred inlet that big barrel into the wood! Just not an option in this case. Got to work with what was supplied to me. See the step in the wood by the lock bolster? The lock will go in deeper to this step if the barrel is removed. Measured across the wood to the lock bolster without the barrel is about .080 narrower than the barrel diameter. I thought great no problem just file a flat on the side till I get down .080 Problem is then I will have a wood to barrel gap. Only two things I can think of is to notch the barrel for the bolster or fill in a sliver of wood. Ever see a stepped barrel in this area?

Hey John, I do have a friend that has a Pedersoli Bess to look at, for reference. I need to get ahold of that. Once condition on me building it was I get to shoot it first. Future owner already sent me about 25 balls..990 and some .985's 4 to the lb. hehehe

Jeff

J Shingler · « **Reply #10 on:** November 19, 2008, 06:28:47 AM »

Oh yea I can post pics as this project progresses if it is of interest to the list.
Thanks for the advice guys!

Mike Brooks · « **Reply #11 on:** November 19, 2008, 05:52:03 PM »

I'd skip the stepped barrel idea. Just make your side flat so it doesn't run too far down the barrel. I don't believe I filed my side flat on till after the barrel was inlet. In fact I know I didn't. I just finished a round barreled fowler and filed the flat on after the barrel was inlet....no problemo, and no gaps that I recall.
The biggest problem building Wall guns is the weight of the barrel, I ended up with a pretty good case of carpal tunnel and tennis elbow by the time the brute was finished. Mine weighed 38lbs when it was done. I much prefer Carolina guns at 6lbs.....

J.D. · « **Reply #12 on:** November 19, 2008, 09:24:25 PM »

Here ya go, Jeff. The flat appears to be filed parallel, or nearly so, to the axis of the bore and ends just forward of the bolster. The width of the flat, at the back of the barrel is 9/16. The liner is 5/16 dia, for reference.
Good luck,
John

ddeaton · « **Reply #13 on:** November 20, 2008, 12:21:00 AM »

good pic JD, if you need more I will pull mine. Does anyone need a mold for these bad boys?

J Shingler · « **Reply #14 on:** November 20, 2008, 06:43:46 AM »

John Excellent pic. I envisioned a flat running much further up the barrel. Like a 5" long taper. This is much shorter than that and yes does answer some of my questions / problems. Thank you very much! After seeing you r picture and relooking at this beast I have in the shop I believe it will work out. I need a much mor abrupt taper. Thanks again!
Jeff

J.D. · « **Reply #15 on:** November 20, 2008, 09:31:46 PM »

I'm glad I could be of help, Jeff. I don't know much about gun building, but I do have a few beat up old guns laying around to use for reference.

Keep us posted on the build. A video of the first firing would be..interesting, to say the least.

You may need to test fire at long range too. Those wall guns were reported to have the capability to hit a 12 inch, or so, sheet of paper at 600 yards.

A weekend of test firing that beast at Popo Aggie might be an enjoyable respite after all of that work.

Good luck,
J.D.

J Shingler · « **Reply #16 on:** February 07, 2009, 09:24:43 PM »

Back to this wall gun project. Not sure if this will pop to the front again or not so here goes.

I would like to end up with a grey type finish on the wall gun barrel. Not a brown but not a full antique job either just a little color so it is not so in the white bright. Any suggestions?

J.D. · « **Reply #17 on:** February 07, 2009, 09:55:20 PM »

How about a light coating of LMF, carded with a fine wire wheel?

A single light finish, carded after a coupla hours after application, might give a slight brown color by just removing the shine. Kinda like an old, well cared for gun that is acquiring a slight patina.

Or, cold blue and rub back the blue to whatever finish looks good.

Keep us posted,
God bless,
J.D.

Larry Luck · « **Reply #18 on:** February 08, 2009, 05:44:28 AM »

Brownell's Ox-Pho Blue, steel wooled back to gray looks pretty nice.
Larry Luck

J Shingler · « **Reply #19 on:** February 09, 2009, 05:22:10 AM »

Good Ideas guys I will try that on a few test pieces.
Going to finish up the trigger guard tomorrow. (monday)
Then tackel those ram rod thimbles. Then final shaping this beast!
I set it on a set of digital bathroom scales and it went 31 1/2 lb.

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Author Topic: Round barrel wall gun help (Read 8535 times)

J Shingler

J.D.

Roy S.

ddeaton

ddeaton

J Shingler

J Shingler

J.D.

ddeaton

J Shingler

J.D.

J Shingler

J.D.

J Shingler