Lehigh Rifles

[GrampaJack]

In my 50 odd years of observing and, in a few cases, owning old guns my favorite has always been the Lehigh Valley rifles. To my eye the lines are just what an antique American rifle should have. The Rupp gun is just about the best example I have ever seen. Would that I have ever had the wherewithal to buy such a wonderful object. Having said that, I have also ventured into the realm of building guns and have produced some that I was not totally insulted by.  Due to my intense interest in Lehigh guns I attempted builds on 2 occasions. In both cases I took pictures from the Kindig book and had them enlarged by a professional draftsman to the proper dimensions to make an accurate  template to use for the  reproduction. In both cases I ended up with a well executed rifle that was not “shootable”. The problem always was the same, that being the wrist was so straight coming out of the breech that there was no way to get your eye down level with the plane of the barrel in order to properly line up the sights. In the late 90s after considerable frustration over my guns I was able to actually handle an original Lehigh rifle at an OGCA show in Cleveland. To my amazement I had the same problem with the original. How could this be?  How could so many guns be made with such great lines if it was not possible to properly shoot them? When I look at the Rupp I can see where the thumb may interfere with the line of sight when laid over the top of the wrist.  In discussions with other collectors and shooters over the years many have noted the same problem with the Lehigh guns, some more than others. The whole thing just doesn't make sense to me. I want to do another build and hope to buy an original Lehigh before I die but I have to know, is this a real problem, or is just in my head?  Jack

[JTR]

Well GranpaJack, maybe your head isn't attached to your body correctly to be able to shoulder a Lehigh, !

Actually I don't think that's the problem, because they don't fit me either, nor do they seem to fit anyone I know,,,,, if you try to shoulder them on your shoulder.

From what I've heard, and tried, if you shoulder the rifle in the spot between your shoulder and the bicep muscle, it'll fit a lot better.
Now I don't know for a fact that this was the way the original rifles were held/shouldered, but unless the early residents of the Lehigh area built different than everyone else,,, and well,, there doesn't seem to be any proof of that,,,,,is there?

John

[Eric Kettenburg]

Everybody knows all those Lehigh 'dutchmen' were 5' tall with no necks.

[LehighBrad]

I'm 3/4's way finished on my first Lehigh build that comes form a David Keck stock blank. I gotta say, after inletting my butt plate to my desired trigger pull, she shoulders rather nicely! Now I will tell you that my thumb knuckle that wraps up over the wrist area is just below my line of sights down the barrel. However to acheive this I did dovetail in some SLIGHTLY higher front and rear sights (about 1/16" higher that my other rifles).....AND it also helps clear my view if I keep the top of my thumb knuckle hair cleanly shaved!!!

[JTR]

Or just put a little extra drop in the stock, like this one. 



John

[GrampaJack]

I feel a little better, I guess. I just discovered that Nate has started a new thread on a recent Lehigh build over on the gun building forum. It will be interesting to see if he had any issues. Thanks, Jack

[Don Getz]

Jack........The first rifle I ever built was a copy of a Herman Rupp, and I actually shot it quite well for a time.  However, I
have been a rifle shooter all my life and you just can't hold one of these like an ordinary rifle.   NO MORE.  I like to kid
Allen Martin, who does build a lot of Lehigh rifles, and does a great job of it.   I told him I would like to have one of his
guns, as long as it wasn't a "Lehigh"...just kidding, he's a great guy.    To me, there is something about a J.P.Beck rifle
that just makes it feel like a modern bolt action rifle.  I don't know but it might be the trigger guard which bends up to
almost touching the stock, gives you more of a pistol grip feel.   I have also built a lot of Lancaster style Barn Guns and
they feel good too.............Don

[smallpatch]

Grampa,

Lehigh's also have a reputation of being cheek smackers, BUT

I'm on my second Lehigh build, and I own one built by the great Allen Martin, and while your thumb is just below your cheekbone, it's in no way IN THE WAY!
I've shot them with 90g FFFg loads, no cheek smack.

Maybe I'm built more like the Penn/Dutch settlers than a present day human.  I'm not sure but I sure like those Lehighs.  Nothing else out there quite so attractive architecturally.  What a mystery.

[D. Taylor Sapergia]

I've seen some contemporary builds of Lehigh rifles that would definitely be difficult to shoot.  But I don't think it's necessary.  I have only built two of them - a Herman Rupp and a Jacob Kuntz, and neither of them are difficult to shoot at all - no cheek slap and in fact, my Kuntz rifle is my favourite.  It's a .40 calibre and likes 65 grains 3Fg.  The Herman Rupp is a .45 cal. and it too is pleasant to shoot.  I will point out here that both rifles are in the 9 pound range with beefy barrels.  If you make a .45 cal around a parallel 13/16" barrel - that might me another issue.
As to drop at comb and heel...I used the dimensions of the originals I was emulating, and they worked out well.  Also, I have had the privilege of studying a fabulous collection of Lehigh rifles on two occasions, and I was not struck by an impression that they did not have sufficient drop, or too straight a wrist.  Here's a couple of pics of the two Lehigh rifles I spoke of...




I also agree with Don Getz that Allan Martin's Lehigh rifles are outstanding.

[Don Getz]

Taylor.......two good looking guns, great job....................Don

[smylee grouch]

Yes I like those Lehigh guns too, but some thing puzzles me about them. It seems as though most of the ones I have seen have a more redish hue or color than guns from the other areas. I am sure someone will explain or corect me if I'm wrong.  Is this a Lehigh trait?    Smylee

[mr. no gold]

Some people call it 'Allentown Red.' Seems to have been a preferred finish color in that region.
Dick

[GrampaJack]

I took a look at Allen Martin's web site. WOW, Jack

[GrampaJack]

I contacted Allen Martin and asked if he had any comments on our subject. Now, I'm sure he is a very busy guy BUT, he took the time to provide some pointers that will help a great deal when I start my build. He certainly did not have to do that.  In addition to the gift of being able to create some extraordinary objects in every sense of the word, maybe we should also include the willingness to help others in our definition of "Master".  So thank you to all who have helped with my dilemma and a special tip of the hat to master Allen.  Jack