showing of first rifles

[Dr. Tim-Boone]

Are  you telling me that you did all that engraving as well as designed and made your own locks as a teenager?? You are amazing!

[rich pierce]

When I see the range among first rifles, it's clear that some folks are naturally or unnaturally gifted.

[Dr. Tim-Boone]

I think I will just go make shovels..............

[Long Ears]

When I see the range among first rifles, it's clear that some folks are naturally or unnaturally gifted.

Rich, I think you are dead on with that statement. I am still not sure which side of the statement I am on however.
Dr. Tim, I was stariring at the engraving thinking about when I was 17. Girls, that's all I got???
Davec2, a true artist from the beginning. Thanks for sharing. Bob

[Ed Wenger]

Rich, I agree.  Tim, got any shovel blanks I can buy?....

Really good stuff, great thread.

             Ed

[TMerkley]

I still haven't borrowed the rifle back from my friend,  The background of the current pictures I have don't do much for it, so bear with me, I will get them hear soon.  I enjoy looking at everyone's work.  I now know, that I am not alone.  I have some other projects in the works, but, I still am waiting on the opportunity to saw the log down for the stock.  Same tree as the first, it just sat out about two years longer before I pulled it out of the woods with the garden tractor.  I love that old hydrastat Montgomery Ward!

[Lucky R A]

Dave,  That much talent and knowledge of how to cast, engrave etc. does not just spontaneously exhibit itself at any age.  You had to have access to others who were knowledgeable in the process of lost wax casting, the techniques of engraving etc.  You have tremendous artistic talent and a far above normal intelect to achieve what you have in life and artistically.  Who were your mentors (schools, friends ?)in some of these techniques.   I remember looking at the blunderbus that you built, the engraving on your two early guns is very similar to the later blunderbus.  The engraving style is unique, more sophisticated and unlike that normally seen on longrifles

[Dave B]

Dave, Great work on the rifles.  Is the heart in the toe plate the release button for the patch box? Really cool stuff.

[davec2]

Dr. Tim - I was trying to make the story short...yes, I made the locks, and most of the other parts, but I started to teach myself how to engrave a couple of years later while I was at the Naval Academy.  I didn't finish the engraving on the matched rifles for several years.  Actually though, I had to make the stock for the first rifle twice.  I had finished the shaping and was getting ready to stain it and I had left it lying on the garage floor on news paper while I was off to the store to get stain.  While I was gone, my mother came home and drove over the stock while she was parking the car.  So, although this was my first rifle, it was my second stock.

Long Ears - I would gladly have swapped some casting instruction for a couple of girl's phone numbers at the time.

Lucky - From the time I was 7 or 8, I worked for my Dad as a dental technician in his laboratory.  I learned to do castings making dental bridges and crowns.  Carving natural dentition anatomy in wax and plastic was good training for long rifle carving.  My father also taught me to do jewelry work in silver, gold, and platinum, although he started me out practicing with beryllium copper (which works a lot like gold).  In fact, the trigger on the first rifle is bright.  I couldn't blue it because I cast it of of a chrome cobalt alloy that we used in the lab to make cast dental partial frames. The beginning engraving was just a natural extension of that type of work and it took me a long time to teach myself even to cut a "sort of straight" line.  A few years ago I spent 10 days with Jerry Huddleston and he taught me more about engraving in those few days than I had learned on my own in 20 years.  My engraving is a mish mash of styles and designs that have appealed to me along the way and doesn't look like anything very co-ordinated or traditional.  But, if I keep practicing, I will get to an acceptable level at some point.

Dave B - Yes, the heart in the toe plate is the release button.

[mountainman]

Poor mother, she drove over a gun.

[TMerkley]

Alright,

Here we go.  My first attempt to post items.

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Please bear with me, these photos are over a year old now.  I did not have a good place to take pictures at that times,  please excuse the bad lighting.  

Any advice is greatly appreciated.  I realize the wrist is a little thick, but wasn't sure how thick to go with .54 cal.  It is an original swamped barrel. the breech measured 1 1/8 and the muzzle 1 1/16 with 1" about 8 inches back from the muzzle.  All parts except for lock and barrel, drum and  nipple, and screws were made by me.  All copper is scrap copper from around the house. The trigger guard was a single piece of copper tubing that I flattened out, then formed and soldered to make it as it is. It runs under the stock towards the butt.  It did not go all the way, so I formed another piece to go the distance and tacked in place with copper tacks.  The ramrod I made from a hickory tree that went down with some Oak trees we sold a few years ago.  The stock is Butternut,  a cousin to the walnut.  Also known as "white walnut" it was cut from a tree that died on my property due to a disease.  A friend had a portable saw mill and we cut a blank from that.  The front sight is a nickel cut down and soldered to copper base.  The rear sight was piece of angle ireon I cut down.  The rear sight sits 1/16 of an inch taller than the front sight.  It shoots 3" high at 25 yards without adjustment.  I also made the trigger and trigge plate from scrap iron as well.  

If you pay special attention to the grain, you will notice that the grain runs through the entire length of the stock from muzzle to butt plate, through the wrist.  I The tree was not a straight trunk and I laid the pattern over the grain to get what you see.  I only had a cardboard pattern from an antique store and a half-stock 35 cal that was made around the forty's for guidence along with the Foxfire vol. 5 and the school of hard knox to learn from.

Thanks ,

Tom.

(moderator RP fixed the pictures while leaving the non-functional text.  If you want to see the difference between what did not work and what did work, go to "modify" and look at the posting text and you will see the functional image addresses have this:  )

[rich pierce]

OK, I'll bite on this one.  I give you credit for ingenuity and resourcefulness!  The wood grain sure is attractive.  And if it's a good shooter then you'll enjoy your handiwork.  Of course if your main resources were a Foxfire book and a gun from the revival period of black powder shooting, your results would be different than if you'd studied fine contemporary work or originals.  I am sure you learned a lot about how a rifle works and the basic tasks of assembly. 

[Roger Fisher]

OK, I'll bite on this one.  I give you credit for ingenuity and resourcefulness!  The wood grain sure is attractive.  And if it's a good shooter then you'll enjoy your handiwork.  Of course if your main resources were a Foxfire book and a gun from the revival period of black powder shooting, your results would be different than if you'd studied fine contemporary work or originals.  I am sure you learned a lot about how a rifle works and the basic tasks of assembly.  

I don't know what to say so I won't say anything.    Other than get the books get the books Chuck Dixon's is a good one to start with - He walks you thru the process......step by step with good line drawings.... Alexander's books more (much more) detailed....

[TMerkley]

I figure I still have a few years of learning yet as I am 34.  So, as far as learning how everything fits together, I sure figured that one out. I know it comes nowhere near what you all produce here.

[TMerkley]

You all are the experts, that is why I am here.   

By the way, I worked the lock and got the trigger down to 5#.

I also figured I would get the "What in the #$]] were you thinking?"  Response.  The main reason for not posting in the first place.  But, oh well.  It shoots. 

[J.Cundiff]

I think for a first build, without much reference to go by, or assistance from experience, it's not bad. The important things are 1) You DID IT. You finished it, it shoots, you saw it through to completion. 2) You know you made mistakes and have room for improvement, which is why you posted it on here. 3) You still have desire to keep at it and get better.

I'm guessing you built it from a blank? I would say for your 2nd gun, you should do yourself the favor of beginning with a pre-carved stock. There's still plenty of work to do, but it's a good foundation to begin with, and you will learn about the basic architecture of the rifle and how it should be shaped. Then, when you go back to building from a blank, you'll have a much better idea of what the end result should be.

John

[TMerkley]

Thanks, 
That is the guidence I am looking for.  I started with an idea, and it developed it as I went.  The best compliment I am guessing that a builder can get from someone who has only shot modern rifles and inlines is "Wow! that is the smoothest shooting rifle I have ever shot!"  And the person who received it as a gift said  "No one has ever done anything like this for me."  (Friendship)  He saved my butt!. 

If you can't read the side plate,  It says " To John Ryan Glover II   Who saved my life 3-18-2006".

[Dr. Tim-Boone]

You will do far greater work Tom. But it may never be as important as what you did for your friend!! Good Move!!    Keep building. Take the advice and talk to Dave Keck at Knob Mtn about a precarve.  Measure twice, ask questions and then cut!!

[TMerkley]

Since this build I have been buying parts for a JP Beck.  I have a Dickert Lock from LR, steel cast butt plate and trigger guard from Muzzleloader Builders supply.  I wondered if the Samuel Beck Barrel I picked up at Friendship would be appropriate.  It still has the orginal sites.  It is about a 36 cal.  I plan on using a precarve for that one.  Saving money for that one. 

[J.Cundiff]

Wow... that's a great story! And 3-18 is my birthday, so it's a special day for me too. Awesome stuff.

When you choose your precarved stock, you just need to make sure that the profile of the barrel you bought will match the inletting on the stock. You should definitely CALL the stock supplier and discuss it with them before purchasing... don't just order it online, make sure they know what you're building and what barrel you're using so you're not stuck with a stock that won't work with the barrel you have.

Keep at it!

[coopersdad]

Darn allergies... I'm sure he treasures it more than if you bought him a $10k custom rifle. I would in his place. Well done.

[Robby]

http://americanlongrifles.org/old_board/index.php?topic=12150.0
Robby

[JDK]

TMerkley,

If you order from Dave Keck you can send him your barrel and he can inlet it into any pattern provided your breech dimensions allow.  That's the nice part about going that route as the options are almost limitless.

Knowing how involved you've been on this site and imagining the many high quality guns we've seen on here, I give you allot of credit for posting your first gun.  Your proud of it and you should be, it took allot creativity and work.  Many a builders first guns have ended up in the wood stove.

It is a credit to the members of this board on how they handled their responses to your post.  Lesser men would not have tempered their words and just come out blasting without considering the whole story.....and the story makes the gun.

Thanks, J.D.

[TMerkley]

Thanks,  I know it's not pretty, 

During the course of the build, I had to adjust (raise) the drop and LOP to my friends features, Part of the reason it is a pretty high comb.  Looking back, I now know that I could have shaved at least 5/16" out from under the forearm. and taken alot more off the wrist.  Last spring I didn't have a clue, but now, the fuzzy picture is getting clearer. 

I had two patterns of original guns from an antique store, (pawn shop)  both smaller caliber about 36.  and full stock.  They both appeared to be Ohio style with very thin but stock and a significant drop.  Niether gun had a name on the barrel and one had brass over lays and a name on the patch box that said D LEE.  I could not afford what they were wanting for them at the time.  175 each. The other one, had a blown out drum, missing hammer and a bullet lodged in the barrel about 12 inches from the breech and cracked stock.  I offered 200 for both rifles and walked out empty handed.   Oh well. 

At the time, I decided to do this project I was on extremely limited funds.  I had $110. and a 5 gallon bucket of cow and sheep horns,on me when I went to friendship in 09.  The money went to cover membership and part of campsite fees. By the time I left, I walked out with a 75 dollar original swamped barrel, a 40 dollar lock, and a new belt.  Then went the many hours of what the heck am I going to do with this? How does this work? and I need to make this.... and this... and that...  By the way, I need to have a new breech plug put in. 25 dollars there.  and 5 cents for the front site.  Oh by the way. My wife had to have a malignant brain tumor removed during that time. The stroke on the table, and many hours sittinging in PT and OT sessions.  I needed something to stay sane as I worked in my man cave til 4 am after work until the beating of the cane on the cieling above me became overwhelming. Well, there it is. Frankenstein. 

He did more than save my life, he kept me going after that. 

[Cory Joe Stewart]

I figure I still have a few years of learning yet as I am 34.  So, as far as learning how everything fits together, I sure figured that one out. I know it comes nowhere near what you all produce here.

I was 34 when I finished my first one.  I turn 35 this fall.

Coryjoe