Small flintlocks

[Ezra]

I would like some opinions.  What is the smallest, readily available (read, not TRS), quality flintlock that could be used for a small pistol?  Hollenbaughs pistol lock is 4.2" x .770".  Davis "Becky" is 4.18" x .81".  So far those are the smallest I've found.  TRS does have a tiny lock with the sideplate of only 3", but I am not particularly interested in that one (price - wait and replacement parts...).  Thanks for the help.


Ez

[C. ALTLAND]

Ezra,

You could try E J Blackley and Son  http://www.blackleyandson.com/acatalog/Lock_Sets_English_Flat_Faced.html they have many locks available that are not listed on their web site.
Or take a look at the pistol lock made by Mike Rowe at Quality Locks Inc.http://www.caywoodguns.com/locks.htm
Stan's Ditchburn pistol lock sure is a fine pistol lock.

[smart dog]

Hi Ezra,
Becky's lock is the smallest commercially made lock that I know of.  I could not find any that would work for my dueling pistols so I eventually purchased castings from E. J. Blackely.  They have a number of small lock plates and parts to choose from.  Almost all of the commercial locks for pistols are too long for anything but large pistols. They work if you are making a "Kentucky" pistol or any large pistol but for many smaller guns they won't work well without a lot of alterations.  They make smaller stocks look really clumsy because the long plate forces you to keep the stock staight behind the breech for too long a distance to really copy the elegant shape of many English and European pistols.  I wish someone in the states would make a lock similar to the one below (with or without the safety).

     

dave

[J. Talbert]

If you check out Jack Brooks website, take note of the beautiful Allentown rifle.  It is actually 3/4 scale with a 3/4 scale hand made lock, fashioned after an original Bonewitz lock that Jack owns.  He made castings off the lock and he may or may not have a complete set.  Can't hurt to ask...
I've got one on my boys' 3/4 scale rifle and works great.

Jeff

[Ezra]

Hi Ezra,
Becky's lock is the smallest commercially made lock that I know of.  I could not find any that would work for my dueling pistols so I eventually purchased castings from E. J. Blackely.  They have a number of small lock plates and parts to choose from.  Almost all of the commercial locks for pistols are too long for anything but large pistols. They work if you are making a "Kentucky" pistol or any large pistol but for many smaller guns they won't work well without a lot of alterations.  They make smaller stocks look really clumsy because the long plate forces you to keep the stock staight behind the breech for too long a distance to really copy the elegant shape of many English and European pistols.  I wish someone in the states would make a lock similar to the one below (with or without the safety).

     

dave

Hey Dave,

What is the length of your Wogden lock?  Height?  I just sent for their (Blackleys) catalogue. 

This is the tiny one from TRS I was talking about.  3" lockplate.

http://www.therifleshoppe.com/(659).htm

Ez

[smart dog]

Hi Ezra,
The length is 4" and the maximum height is 13/16".  The lock tapers nicely toward the tail so it is really easy to shape the stock into a graceful curve behind the breech.  Ezra, I learned a lot from building these pistols.  I now understand very clearly that there is much more to the cane-type handle than I originally thought.  For me one of the discoveries was that a stock that starts to taper downward right after the breech allowed me to shape the stock so that my trigger finger doesn't touch any wood.  The slight bulge at the bottom catches under the pinkie and the middle portion of the curve catches in the muscle at the base of my thumb.  As a result those two points take the majority of the weight and balance of the gun (through a kind of camming leverage) and there is no stress on the trigger finger. That was a revelation.  I have started to understand the art of building pistols thanks to Robert Wogdon.

dave

[Ezra]

Hi Ezra,
The length is 4" and the maximum height is 13/16".  The lock tapers nicely toward the tail so it is really easy to shape the stock into a graceful curve behind the breech.  Ezra, I learned a lot from building these pistols.  I now understand very clearly that there is much more to the cane-type handle than I originally thought.  For me one of the discoveries was that a stock that starts to taper downward right after the breech allowed me to shape the stock so that my trigger finger doesn't touch any wood.  The slight bulge at the bottom catches under the pinkie and the middle portion of the curve catches in the muscle at the base of my thumb.  As a result those two points take the majority of the weight and balance of the gun (through a kind of camming leverage) and there is no stress on the trigger finger. That was a revelation.  I have started to understand the art of building pistols thanks to Robert Wogdon.

dave

Hey Dave,

Well, you could hardly have  a better pistolsmith to learn the art from than Mr. Wogdon.  As far as your duellers, did you have a pattern from which you built them, or did you just build them by eye?  Don't even tell me you have an original set (I would have to die from envy... ).  There is a definite "art" to them.  It has been my desire for some time to build a nice set.  Talent/experience wise, I am not there yet, but all in time.  Thanks for the help.  Looking forward to getting Blakeley's catalogue.


Ez

[smart dog]

Hi Ezra,
Kevin Blackley is a gem to deal with.  Unfortunately the exchange rate makes things a bit expensive for us but the quality is worth it.  Blackley's parts are made from mild steel so you must case harden them.  I wish I could handle an original pair of Wogdons but I have handled Innes, Bond, and John Manton pistols.  They educated me a bit but I mostly intuited Wogden's secrets by scaling some photos and then building the pistols from those photos.  But of course the trick is that Wogden built those pistols in the photos for someone else's hand.  I had to think about the basic shapes and features and then adapt them to my hand.  I think I did it and I think I understand. 

dave