Author Topic: New rifle completed (Read 8515 times)

David R. Pennington · « **on:** August 03, 2012, 05:20:15 AM »

Hopefully I did it right. If so here are some pictures of one I've been working on. Constructive criticism welcome. Barrel is .62 Colerain oct./rd., lock is Chambers Va., triggergaurd is old casting modified, everything else is homemade. Buttplate is forged iron. What do you think?

Hi this is Rich Pierce a moderator. I tried to clean up the pictures which were tangled together making a wide screen. Might have lost one or two, hope not. It helps to have each photo on a separate line, and even a space between lines.

ontarget · « **Reply #1 on:** August 03, 2012, 06:22:09 AM »

Looks great especially the carving. Is this your first attempt at building a rifle? Was it built from a kit? And what experience do you have in wood carving?

Wood appears to be walnut which is a fairly had wood. Was it difficult to carve?

Woodbutcher · « **Reply #2 on:** August 03, 2012, 06:35:22 AM »

Walnut and iron, outstanding! Please, what length barrel and what is the weight of the gun? What was used to color the iron? Thank you, Woodbutcher

Roger Fisher · « **Reply #3 on:** August 03, 2012, 05:06:43 PM »

So, did you shoot her yet? How low did she shoot with that high frt blade ? Appears as tho you will do quite a bit of blade filing which is all part of the fun..

rich pierce · « **Reply #4 on:** August 03, 2012, 05:53:38 PM »

There's a lot to like there, nice lines, good execution, lock panels, general architecture. I love the sideplate. Areas I'd do differently include the top line of the comb which looks dead straight on top (I like a little roundness) and the nose of the comb and the way it is tapered, which look a little abrupt.

Mike Brooks · « **Reply #5 on:** August 03, 2012, 07:43:58 PM »

Overall I like the gun. The comb is a bit abrupt. If I built this gun these are things I would have done differently...these are MY quirks, not necessarily right or wrong. I'd thin the buttplate edge. I'd shoe about 2/3rd of the barrel flats at the sides. The carving behind the cheek piece is well done but I don't feel it is appropriate for a plainer gun. I'd have gone with a large volute at the rear and a smaller one at the front.....just me. I'd have to do something with that wood color looks dead, again, just me, I don't like real light walnut.

Dr. Tim-Boone · « **Reply #6 on:** August 03, 2012, 10:26:44 PM »

Is that a Dogwood blossom

peaking out from under the tail of the cheekpiece??

Dr. Tim-Boone · « **Reply #7 on:** August 03, 2012, 10:29:11 PM »

I too would like to see more barrel above the forestock... Your muzzle treatment is real simple but elegant. Tapered rod lays up there nice and tight!! I like it.

Daryl · « **Reply #8 on:** August 04, 2012, 04:32:37 AM »

I'm so new at this critiquing, I didn't realize what I was actually looking at, until Dr. Tim mentioned the amount of barrel. Yeah - me too. Looking pretty good to me overall- few minor points alread meantioned - good though. I really like the walnut.

Dr. Tim-Boone · « **Reply #9 on:** August 04, 2012, 05:06:44 AM »

David, Did you use a black filler in the WALNUT??

Dennis Glazener · « **Reply #10 on:** August 04, 2012, 04:47:14 PM »

Quote

David, Did you use a black filler in the WALNUT??

I am not sure if he did or not but I have used black filler in walnut and it really looks great with those black pores and the rest left natural.
Dennis

Topknot · « **Reply #11 on:** August 04, 2012, 05:54:08 PM »

DAVID,I am new to gun building , but i would like to congratulate on your effort. I really like the side plate and the patch box. the carving is very clean and crisp!
I would also like to know what kind of flower that is behind the cheekpiece? well done. thats my opinion.

Don Tripp · « **Reply #12 on:** August 04, 2012, 06:07:22 PM »

Quote from: Dennis Glazener on August 04, 2012, 04:47:14 PM

Quote
David, Did you use a black filler in the WALNUT??
I am not sure if he did or not but I have used black filler in walnut and it really looks great with those black pores and the rest left natural.
Dennis

How did you apply the filler and what did you use?

Dennis Glazener · « **Reply #13 on:** August 04, 2012, 07:05:50 PM »

I learned to use the black (and brass/silver/white) filler in High School Ind Arts class. Our teacher did his thesis on different type of wood finishes. He had a brass ring of 12" square pieces of wood with the formula on the back and the finish it produced on the front. Some of them were quite wild!

As I remember the formula was to raise the grain and sand until no more whiskers came up from the sizing solution he used. Then put on a sealer, then mix lamp black with white wood filler rub on until pores are filled. Let dry for a short while then use burlap to rub off cross grain. Let dry then seal again then apply varnish then rub down with pumice then rotten stone on felt.

The last I did I could not find white wood filler and use sheetrock compound instead. Seemed to work just as well but I am not saying you should use it since I don't know how it holds up long term.

I plan on using black filler on the rifle I am working on now and found black wood filler here : http://www.constantines.com/pastewoodfiller.aspx it looks like it would work great.
Dennis

Gene Carrell · « **Reply #14 on:** August 05, 2012, 01:06:02 PM »

I have used Constantines to great effect on walnut. I am working on an ash stock and plan to use it again. The last I bought came from Chambers at Friendship. Just rub it in and bag it off. Works great.

David R. Pennington · « **Reply #15 on:** August 06, 2012, 03:16:55 PM »

I just got back in town from a funeral late last night. Thanks for all the input guys.
That is exactly what I want to hear as I want to improve hopefully with each build. Thanks Rich for the help with the photographs. I'll try to answer some of the questions and maybe ask aome more. This is my fourth build and none of them were from a kit. All from a bandsawn blank and parts. I have no woodcarving experience and it probably shows. Some of these days when I finish paying college tuitions I might be able to get in on some of the seminars and classes and learn how.
The barrel is 44" and the best I can tell on the little scale I have is it weighs around 8# 11 oz.
The finish on the metal is browning solution from Cain's Outdoors in Williamstown,WV. The parts have to really be clean for it to work. The barrel streaked a little, I guess I didn't get it cleaned enough. I boiled the small parts and then cleaned with laquer thinner. After the browning solution gets a good coat of rust started I card it off with a soft brass brush and add more solution to get it darker and when it gets dark enough I throw the small parts into boiling water for a little while and then coat them with oil and burn off the oil with a propane torch.
I havn't shot her yet and yes I'm sure that front sight is way too high. I may get to shoot her today as one of our club members passed away and we will shoot a salute to him at the funeral.
I see what you mean about softening those angles on the comb. As to the reveal on the sides of barrel, I get a little nervous about taking wood off the forestock but I am sure you are right. It would look "lighter" with more barrel exposed.
I know this started out to be a really plain gun but I got a little carried away. Originally it wasn't even going to have a buttplate or rear thimble but one thing led to another and the carving just kind of grew there. Yes dogwwood blossom was the inspiration for the flower.
I struggle with the wood finish and I agree it looks dead. Got any suggestions? I didn't use any filler, just whiskerred several times and several coats of linseed oil. I did rub it down a couple times with rottenstone between coats.

Dennis Glazener · « **Reply #16 on:** August 06, 2012, 06:32:25 PM »

Quote

The parts have to really be clean for it to work. The barrel streaked a little, I guess I didn't get it cleaned enough. I boiled the small parts and then cleaned with laquer thinner. After the browning solution gets a good coat of rust started I card it off with a soft brass brush and add more solution to get it darker and when it gets dark enough I throw the small parts into boiling water for a little while and then coat them with oil and burn off the oil with a propane torch.

Try Laurel Mountain Forge browning and skip all the cleaning/degreasing. Brownells carries it as well as other vendors. Best I have used and I have tried a lot of different browning methods.
Dennis

bgf · « **Reply #17 on:** August 06, 2012, 07:58:44 PM »

I don't know if it would be the effect you want, but tinting the finish oil really warms up and somehow deepens/livens up the look of the wood. Where I live, the straight tint is hard to find (and mail order is risky in terms of ending up with a lot of something that's useless sometimes), so I have been using the commonly available Minwax Polyshades to whatever (oil) finish I am using. That product is a tinted polyurethane (horror:gasp:ack) all-in-one stain and finish (really a toner, as the tint is almost entirely transparent), but with the darker colors, you only need a little in your finish to impart some tint. Personally I don't feel that a small amount of poly is any more evil than any other resin, but opinions vary. However you achieve it, an additional coat or two of a tinted finish might do the trick.

I like the rifle, but I've seen your earlier more Honakeresque rifles and feel you might have strayed too far with this sideplate, just because I liked the others so well; it is good on its own, I suppose

! I really like the round cheekpiece and the carving, and your forgings are very nice as always. Does the triggerguard have enough room for my fat fingers

?

David R. Pennington · « **Reply #18 on:** August 06, 2012, 09:32:18 PM »

What I was trying to get with this one was an earlier southern English influence style, possibly put together near the frontier using some old musket parts hence the musket style guard and sideplate and round faced lock. There is plenty of room in that guard with a single trigger even for a gloved hand but I better be careful with gloves. I ended up with a really light trigger pull. I can't wait to see how it does at the range. It seems to fit perfectly, when I put it up to my shoulder it is where it needs to be. I've got to get in the shop and turn a jag so I can clean it.

Stophel · « **Reply #19 on:** August 06, 2012, 10:12:07 PM »

I like the gun overall. The round cheekpiece, though neat, I think detracts from the "believability" of it being an 18th c. American gun. The little stepped pointy deal at the rear of the lock panels is unusual, BUT, that sort of thing is occasionally seen on odd old guns. The treatment of the nose of the comb looks a bit "stark" to me, but it may be the photos. Also, the wood around the box lid appears rather flattish, but this also could just be the lighting in the photos.

The finish looks unfinished to me. Dull and with lots of open grain. Not too many usable ready made finishes I would recommend, other than making your own genuine, THICK boiled linseed oil!

Tried and True "Varnish oil" does work, but you have to be patient and let each THIN coat dry, dry, dry in LOTS of sunlight. You can also go to Wal Mart, in the crafts section and find a little glass bottle of Daler-Rowney purified Linseed oil. This is pretty dang good stuff, good for making paint with, and being purified, dries relatively quickly. Both of these will work better than the standard can of "boiled" linseed oil from the hardware store.

I personally don't like black grain filler, I use the oil to fill the grain. Sanding dust can also be used... let the wood fill the wood grain!

The linseed oil you have on it now (I assume it is store-bought "boiled" linseed oil) should be set in the sun to dry. For several days.... maybe weeks, depending upon how heavily it has been applied. When it is DRY, and no more oil boils out in the hot sun, and it smells different (I can tell by the smell of it when it is dry), then leave it out in the sun for another day or two, for good measure, and apply another THIN coat. Wipe the excess oil off the surface of the wood. Repeat until the grain is near filled. For the last coat or two, put it on more heavily, and let it stand on the surface. Put it in the sun to nearly dry, then cut it off the surface of the wood with burlap (this is the "hand rubbing" in a "hand rubbed oil finish"!!! LOTS of elbow grease is required). If necessary, do it again until the grain is completely filled and the surface is smooth.

Rottenstone is a polishing compound, and I don't know that it would be all that useful to you with an oil finish (though it is used as a grain filler as well by some).

David R. Pennington · « **Reply #20 on:** August 06, 2012, 10:34:51 PM »

I agree the finish looks unfinished and I'll keep working on it till it suits me. As for the cheekpiece rifles 96, 110, 113, 122, 128 in ROCA vol. II all have roumded cheekpiece edges and most are attributed by Shumway to last quarter of 18th century. At least one is documented according to him.

kutter · « **Reply #21 on:** August 06, 2012, 10:51:30 PM »

I like it.
I'd have filled the pores in the wood more,,but if you use it, it'll get that way naturally and in the right areas for the aged and used look.

I'd avoid using a brass brush to card the rust brown/blue. Brass wire brushes can sometimes leave a fine coating of the brass metal itself on the steel surface. It kind of rubs off,,as does other soft metal like copper.
It'll leave discolored areas that appear like a stain or smear on the surface of the next coating as the ultra-thin layer of brass won't rust.
Not all brass brushes might do that, but if the wire is soft enough and/or you use enough pressure you can make it happen.

There's carding brushes both rotary and hand brushes just for rust bluing and browning. But steel wool, burlap, canvas or other semi rough materials work too. De-oil the steel wool before use.
I'll second the use of Laurel Mountain solution. Easy to work with and great results.

Roger Fisher · « **Reply #22 on:** August 07, 2012, 01:57:51 AM »

Yes, the Laurel Mt brown works for me so it has to be good.

Walnut is an open pored wood and the grain can be filled with repeated (did I say repeated?) apps of the good ol Leaded/boiled linseed oil. Cast about and get hold of some if I were you. After those pores fill up she'l get that lovely hand rubbed sheen which most of us love to see on our stocks. When you get tired of rubbing keep rubbing

pathfinder · « **Reply #23 on:** August 07, 2012, 04:31:26 AM »

Yup,the paste wood filler is what we use in the re-finishing biz. Comes in a varity of colors,but I like black for walnut. I also use an analine dye before a sealer coat then the filler. Orange analine gives a very claen crisp color to the walnut,as does a little yellow too. It's all dependant on YOUR taste and what your trying to achive. Using a GOOD quality oil as a finish will help block the U/V and prolong the colorfastness.

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Author Topic: New rifle completed (Read 8515 times)

ontarget

Daryl

Don Tripp