Author Topic: CLA Show -- Discussion starter for after the show  (Read 24231 times)

Offline flintriflesmith

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CLA Show -- Discussion starter for after the show
« on: August 13, 2012, 01:13:06 AM »
I won’t be attending the CLA  show this year but I want to propose a “discussion starter,” for a conversation that all of us can participate in when those of you who are able to attend the show get back to the board.

As you look at all the new and old long rifles at the show, ask yourself this question: “If by some magic I could take any ONE of these home with me, which one would I choose and why?” But here are the rules: (1) You can never sell or trade this choice in your lifetime; (2) When you die your estate will have to give it away --- no profit or tax write off. During your lifetime you can use or display the gun as you like and that may be one of the primary reasons for your selection. Literally dozens of other reasons come into play: fancy or plain; golden age or early; iron or brass; forged or cast; Lancaster or Winston Salem; historically accurate or …

To avoid comparing apples and oranges I propose that you attendees each make two selections --- One contemporary gun and one period gun. If at all possible take a picture of your choices so those of us unable to attend will be able to follow your comments.
The point of this mental exercise is to encourage us gun builders to think about what we truly value and to focus on being able to express those values. It isn’t a new question and it can be applied to just about any hobby or collecting passion.
Gary
"If you accept your thoughts as facts, then you will no longer be looking for new information, because you assume that you have all the answers."
http://flintriflesmith.com

Offline Eric Smith

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Re: CLA Show -- Discussion starter for after the show
« Reply #1 on: August 13, 2012, 01:25:48 AM »
That one ought to get some wheels turning!    ;D ;D ;D
Eric Smith

billd

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Re: CLA Show -- Discussion starter for after the show
« Reply #2 on: August 13, 2012, 01:43:58 AM »
Looking forward to this one.  Take lots of pictures.

Bill

Offline smylee grouch

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Re: CLA Show -- Discussion starter for after the show
« Reply #3 on: August 13, 2012, 03:21:26 AM »
Thanks for the great proposal, Gary. The rules for the discussion and selections are great. Look forward to the debate/banter.   ;D   Smylee

Offline Acer Saccharum

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Re: CLA Show -- Discussion starter for after the show
« Reply #4 on: August 13, 2012, 04:58:41 PM »
I wish I were attending this year. I like this 'assignment' idea. Tom
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Offline tallbear

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Re: CLA Show -- Discussion starter for after the show
« Reply #5 on: August 13, 2012, 05:02:23 PM »
Geeze Gary now I have homework ;D ;D ;D I like the idea !!!! Sorry You won't be there though.

Mitch Yates

Offline Acer Saccharum

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Re: CLA Show -- Discussion starter for after the show
« Reply #6 on: August 13, 2012, 11:10:22 PM »
So this question is not about $$$; ie: NOT for investment, and NOT about WHO made it.

It's about the object. What gun appeals to you the strongest? Can you say why?

Very interesting, Gary. I look forward to the results!
Tom Curran's web site : http://monstermachineshop.net
Ramrod scrapers are all sold out.

Offline rich pierce

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Re: CLA Show -- Discussion starter for after the show
« Reply #7 on: August 14, 2012, 12:47:10 AM »
It's easier to say what we like than to say why we like what we like.  That's cause we're dumb guys.   ;D  It took me 20 years to realize I prefer long-wristed rifles.   A pre-CLA exercise to tune you up: pick a rifle, contemporary or original, that really does it for you, and try to explain what about it is exceptionally appealing to you.

Added in edit- then pick one you love but some others find distasteful, and explain why it appeals to you.
« Last Edit: August 14, 2012, 01:18:55 AM by rich pierce »
Andover, Vermont

Offline Mike Brooks

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Re: CLA Show -- Discussion starter for after the show
« Reply #8 on: August 14, 2012, 06:02:29 PM »
I won't be there, but if I were I'd be at A. Martin's table and Ken Gahagens looking to spend my cash....if I had any. ;D They are doing the kind of work that appeals to me most these days.
NEW WEBSITE! www.mikebrooksflintlocks.com
Say, any of you boys smithies? Or, if not smithies per se, were you otherwise trained in the metallurgic arts before straitened circumstances forced you into a life of aimless wanderin'?

Offline bob in the woods

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Re: CLA Show -- Discussion starter for after the show
« Reply #9 on: August 15, 2012, 12:58:02 AM »
Years ago I saw a Buck& ball gun , plain , no buttplate etc done by Eric Kettenburg. It had folk art type stained applications under the stock finish [ pheasant ?] I have never been able to get that picture out of my mind and would purchase something similar in a minute- if I had any money !
Originals- anything Christian Springs is my kind of rifle. :)

Offline art riser

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Re: CLA Show -- Discussion starter for after the show
« Reply #10 on: August 15, 2012, 02:01:18 AM »
Eric's gun is on The Contemporary Makers' blog...

Offline B Shipman

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Re: CLA Show -- Discussion starter for after the show
« Reply #11 on: August 15, 2012, 07:18:11 AM »
This is a great idea. I'm taking my camera. I suspect there will be a wide variety rather than a concencus.

Offline Acer Saccharum

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Re: CLA Show -- Discussion starter for after the show
« Reply #12 on: August 15, 2012, 04:35:00 PM »
Let's hope for variety, and then discussion! (or a brawl)
Tom Curran's web site : http://monstermachineshop.net
Ramrod scrapers are all sold out.

Sawatis

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Re: CLA Show -- Discussion starter for after the show
« Reply #13 on: August 18, 2012, 04:01:01 AM »
That sounds like fun Gary...I wish I were going! Wonder how the selections will relate to the rifles we chose to build?
John

Offline David R. Pennington

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Re: CLA Show -- Discussion starter for after the show
« Reply #14 on: August 18, 2012, 04:52:05 AM »
Like the idea but just a note of caution about etiquite. I always ask permission when photographing someone's display and especially before posting the pictures.
 It is often difficult to put in words why certain styles appeal  to you. I don't have an "art" background but I can often tell when something looks "right" but can't always tell you why. 
VITA BREVIS- ARS LONGA

Offline kentucky bucky

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Re: CLA Show -- Discussion starter for after the show
« Reply #15 on: August 19, 2012, 07:29:39 AM »
I hope you guys had fun. I didn't go this year due to the spanking my wallet would take for missing last year. I guess I'll have to stay away from now on unless their policy changes.....the punishment will just keep adding up. Guys like me with only $500.00 or so to spend must not matter to the CLA folks any more. Adios!

Offline Acer Saccharum

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Re: CLA Show -- Discussion starter for after the show
« Reply #16 on: August 19, 2012, 03:27:07 PM »
Bucky, membership and sticker shock is covered very well here: http://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=22430.0

I'd like this topic to stay on track.

Thanks,

Tom
Tom Curran's web site : http://monstermachineshop.net
Ramrod scrapers are all sold out.

Offline Don Getz

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Re: CLA Show -- Discussion starter for after the show
« Reply #17 on: August 19, 2012, 04:55:00 PM »
Got home to Pa. about 2 o'clock this morning, left the show just a little after 4 in the afternoon........looong trip.  Great show although it was slighly smaller, not as many tables.   I thought the crowds were pretty good which surprised me.
Saw a lot of old friends, sold a few guns.......a Dave Dodds rifle, and my "Frank and John House gun".   Actually had buyers
looking after they were sold.   Ran into my old friend Dick Miller.  Dick had a table selling some real neat scrapers, shaped
to do all sorts of things.  Overall I thought it was a great show, can't really say what I liked the most, althought Ken Gahagan had a nice display of his fowlers, nice stuff...............Don

Offline rich pierce

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Re: CLA Show -- Discussion starter for after the show
« Reply #18 on: August 19, 2012, 06:38:07 PM »
Here's one that caught my eye.  Sorry I did not get a full length shot.  Why do I like it?

 1)  I like early "roots" rifles, that represent the first rifles made here by European trained gunsmiths, or the first generation of gunsmiths born here.  So that is one category of "attraction- the rifle is in the wheelhouse of my favorite period.

2) The rifle is believable.  Inside of "believeable" is "coherent" to me.  I like a gun to be coherent from one end to the other.  I dislike a formal style in one place and a folksy style in another, hard edges in one place, soft in another, etc.  The furniture, barrel, lock, and architecture all fit together well for a time period and a place of training- which to me is maybe the second quarter of the 1700's and training in one of the Germanic countries.

3) Great architecture.  I like the not so shy belly of the buttstock.  That's a bold design decision within the choices available- a straight toe line, a concave toe line, a stepped wrist that is bold or subtle.  This is surprising but works.

4) The rifle is creative within constraints of what was done.  I do some rifles that are less creative and appreciate builders who have an artistic eye that lets them work within period styles and use new designs effectively.  For me, the carving behind the cheekpiece and the sideplate are creative but coherent.

5) Execution is superb.












« Last Edit: August 20, 2012, 03:43:18 PM by Acer Saccharum »
Andover, Vermont

Offline Mike Brooks

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Re: CLA Show -- Discussion starter for after the show
« Reply #19 on: August 19, 2012, 07:56:26 PM »
Very cool Rich. I have been wanting to build one with that much belly. Would be great for a big bore high recoil rifle. Who built it?
NEW WEBSITE! www.mikebrooksflintlocks.com
Say, any of you boys smithies? Or, if not smithies per se, were you otherwise trained in the metallurgic arts before straitened circumstances forced you into a life of aimless wanderin'?

Offline Acer Saccharum

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Re: CLA Show -- Discussion starter for after the show
« Reply #20 on: August 19, 2012, 08:00:46 PM »
DING!....DING!....DING!....DING!....


Wowie, zowie, that is cool!


The little trailing line off the bottom of the cheekpiece carving does not go with the rest.

Is this a contemporary built gun, or is it an old one? (builders are getting really good these days)
« Last Edit: August 19, 2012, 08:09:20 PM by Acer Saccharum »
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Ramrod scrapers are all sold out.

Offline rich pierce

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Re: CLA Show -- Discussion starter for after the show
« Reply #21 on: August 19, 2012, 09:21:35 PM »
Contemporary, Allen Martin.
Andover, Vermont

Offline J. Talbert

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Re: CLA Show -- Discussion starter for after the show
« Reply #22 on: August 19, 2012, 09:37:55 PM »
Well there's a good one that I missed totally.  
Rich's assessment is on the money.  One of my favorite features is the sideplate.  It seems to fit right into the Moravian - Lehigh evolution, but I don't recall seeing one just like it before.
I like the cheek piece carving, but I'm not sold on that little descending tendril either.

Sorry I missed that one, but it never fails.

Jeff
There are no solutions.  There are only trade-offs.”
Thomas Sowell

Offline Mike Brooks

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Re: CLA Show -- Discussion starter for after the show
« Reply #23 on: August 19, 2012, 10:53:16 PM »
Contemporary, Allen Martin.
Never would have guessed that. Allen must be experimenting with some dark ales. ;D
NEW WEBSITE! www.mikebrooksflintlocks.com
Say, any of you boys smithies? Or, if not smithies per se, were you otherwise trained in the metallurgic arts before straitened circumstances forced you into a life of aimless wanderin'?

Offline Acer Saccharum

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Re: CLA Show -- Discussion starter for after the show
« Reply #24 on: August 19, 2012, 11:34:27 PM »
I was thinking about the possible builders of this rifle, as I was waking from my nap, I knew this was a contemporary gun. (yes, a nap does wonders) And I thought "Allen Martin made that gun". 
Tom Curran's web site : http://monstermachineshop.net
Ramrod scrapers are all sold out.