New to black powder, building a kit

[mahtosapanumpa]

Hello,
   I am new to this forum and new to black powder shooting. I have ordered a Lyman GP cap lock rifle kit. It will be my first B.P. gun.  I am looking forward to building it and carving the stock ( I have carved , I haven't built a gun) I Know I will have to blue or brown the metal parts, but I do not know what that entails. Have any of you made up one of these kits and do you have any advice or encouragement for a beginner? I have seen pictures of guns with metal engraving. Does anybody know what that entails as far as specialized tools?
I am excited, can you tell?  I will also make and carve a powder horn once I get the rifle done but that is another subject.
Thanks, Kirby

[Bioprof]

If you have experience with carving, it shouldn't be a problem putting together one of these kits.  You don't really have to do much fancy carving to put one together unless you want to do some decoration.  For engraving, you need a graver with a handle and a graving hammer.   There are some on this board that are more qualified to give advice on this than me.   

One of the problems with putting together one of these kits is that you can't just stop with one.   I'm sure that you'll be like me,  planning your next one before you're even done with the first, possibly a more challenging one from a set of parts from a place like Track of the Wolf or Pecotonica River.

[northmn]

Before you carve, look at what carving is generally done on ML's by looking at back threads on this discussion.  Browning is the most commonly done and can be accomplished with cold brown's you can pick up from suppliers like Muzzle Loaders Builders Supply or Track of the Wolf (there are others but I use these).  Laurel Mountain Forge used to be a good, and I am sure others will recommend other types.  while browsing look at other kits for future building.  Jim Chambers has good kits also, and a web site.  The Lyman GP is a good beginners kit and makes a nice hunting rifle.  One very artistic builder on this site admits to using one for deer as he cannot afford to keep his own work (at the prices he gets I do not blame him)

DP

[mykeal]

The Lyman GPR is a very good entry level kit and a fine rifle when completed. It can be completed with very little in the way of special tools or skills and will be something you can be proud of. Most importantly, it will not frustrate you to the point of giving up on black powder shooting; in fact, it will encourage you to seek more challenging kits to build in the future.

Whether browning or bluing there are two paths to choose: cold or hot. Both involve the application of chemicals in a special environment; neither is difficult to accomplish with common shop or household tools. For cold browning you can get Laurel Mountain browning solution - it comes with good instructions, needs a humid environment to work well and takes a few days to complete. There are other excellent cold browning products that work as well. A good example of a hot browning product is Birchwood Casey's Plum Brown. It requires the metal to be heated to the point where water will sizzle on the surface. It takes an afternoon to complete. Those are just two examples of many good products and processes available. Birchwood Casey makes a good cold bluing product also. Hot bluing takes some specialized equipment but can be done if desired.

All of the bluing and browning products work best if the metal is properly prepared, which involves sanding and cleaning.

[Larry Luck]

On the topic of bluing, I have tried a couple of the cold chemical blues.  Brownell's Oxpho-Blue is certainly not period correct, but it does provide an easy to apply blue that creates a deep blue-black finish.  It is not as unforgiving as some finishes of contamination on the barrel.  I applied it with pieces of rag and rubbed it in with steel wool soaked with the bluing solution.  I did one barrel this way and was reasonably satisfied with the result.

Rubbed back, it creates a nice grey color.  I did this to the lock, and have used it for similar finishes to antique a hawk and a couple knife blades/

Again, far from PC.

Good luck with your project.  You might find that this hobby cuts into Sunday afternoon football in the fall.

Larry Luck

[mahtosapanumpa]

Bioprof,
Thanks for your response. I am sure you are right about getting hooked. I can see that happening quickly, and I even bought this Lyman kit from track of the Wolf so I am establishing a relationship with those who can aid and abet my progress.  I wanted a kit I would not need any special metal working tools for to begin with. But there are so many beautiful guns and so little time....

Northmn,
     I had not heard of the Chambers kits, I will look into them. I am leaning towards browning, I did not know what that looked like until I started poking around this forum. I do like the blue color on a modern rifle but since I am putting my creativity into this gun it would be better to make it look more period correct even if I go about it in a more modern process.  Thanks for the advice.

Mykeal,
     Thanks for your advice on browning and bluing, I am coming to the conclusion that browning would look more period correct. I will check into this laurel mountain browning solution. My problem is I live in high desert in eastern Oregon, and it is not humid here. It is winter however so perhaps I can do it on the porch where the snow is tracked in daily!  I will head your advice and take the time to prepare the metal properly.

L.Luck,
    Did you post pictures of any of your projects that show the gray color you achieved? I would like to see them.  As far as Cutting into football time, I do not own a TV. so this new hobby will just take away from my bow , arrow making, wood carving, and computer time   I am sure I will be devoting a lot of time to this project and I cannot wait for the weather to ease enough that the UPS guy can get the kit delivered! 


Thanks again for all the replies!
Kirby

[Larry Luck]

Kirby,

I did not take any photos.  Should have, but didn't.  The Oxpho-blue is not really expensive, and you can experiment with a piece of mild steel plate.

Larry Luck 

[Bioprof]

Kirby,

I would highly recommend the LMF cold browning solution.   You can't go wrong with it.   If you live in a drier climate, you can brown the parts in a bathroom where the humidity is higher.   I just hang my barrel from a hanger in the ceiling over the bathroom counter and run some hot water in the shower.   It works great.   Just be careful you don't get the browning solution on your counter, especially if it is white -- don't ask me how I know!

Another method to get the humidity up is to build a humidity chamber.   You can just build a rectangular box and cover it with plastic sheet.    Put a pan of hot water in the bottom and you're good to go.

[northmn]

Another little trick if you are going to build a few is to build a hotbox and keep water in it.  I use my hotbox to dry wood, dry finish and it can be used to brown barrels.  You build a box and wire it for a few lightbulbs.  I used a old heat vent of the right length about 18 by 12 inches.  Should insulate it but it still works.  You can put a can of water or wet towel in them for humidity.  In my neck of the woods its sometimes handy to dehumidify a stock.

DP

[rich pierce]

There's not much use of carving on plains rifles.  I'd keep it plain.

[mahtosapanumpa]

L.Luck,  another member e-mailed me with a picture of what the gray color was, so I got to see it. I am leaning towards the browning at this point.

BioProf,
    I will Get the LMF cold brown for this project but I do not think I would survive the bathroom suggestion.  I tend to be sloppy with liquids and my wife has put too much into building this log cabin for me to let me stain a counter or a floor. 

northmn,
    I may try this hot box idea. I was going to build one for laminating wood bows but have not got to it yet. now I have another reason!

richpierce,
    I believe you are missing my insiration for this project. I got a kit just so I could carve it!

thanks for the replies!
Kirby

[J.D.]

richpierce,
    I believe you are missing my insiration for this project. I got a kit just so I could carve it!

thanks for the replies!
Kirby

Just a thought. You mentioned keeping this rifle historically correct, in browning the metal, so with that in mind, I think Rich is right on. Plains rifles were...well, plain. I have yet to see a plains rifle, or photos of one that is carved, and very few that have appreciable engraving.


Since this is your first attempt at building a ML rifle, I suggest keeping it plain and simple. If you goal is to carve a longrifle, I suggest researching the various schools to see what style of carving you like, then build your second rifle in the school associated with that carving, then carve away.

Just kinda thinkn'...typin' out loud, so to speak...type.
God Bless,
J.D.

[Rich]

The Washington Historical Gunmakers Guild has an event on January 9,10 and 11 in Olympia Washington that includes an "open forum" where you can bring a project and work on it with the advise of experienced builders. It's pretty much a one on one workshop. Meals are included and you can sleep in the semi heated shop. If your interested, Google: Washington Historical Gunmakers Guild. Click on Washington State Muzzleloaders. They have contact information from last year that's still good. Also, the first kit I built was a great plains kit. It's a great first build.

[mahtosapanumpa]

Rich, thanks for the info I will check it out. I doubt I will be able to make it this year but It would be fun to attend a workshop like that.

J.D.
   Not knowing much about historical accuracy, I wanted this rifle to appear old yet carved fancy. My goal is to create a functional rifle that has a carved stock, because I like to carve. I have carved scenes on a couple of modern rifles. I have carved numerous canes and walking staffs and now I want to carve a whole muzzle loader stock. I chose this kit as it was the best I could afford without knowing what I am doing as far as putting the gun together. 

I will now re-define this project as: a first rifle, CREATIVE build without attempting historical accuracy. I hope this will not offend the experts here such as yourself, as I would like to ask some questions as I go along. Not that I do not want to know about what would be historically accurate, because I do!  I just have an idea for this build that involves carving.

so that said,

I filed and sanded the trigger guard today.  it has a slight warp in it that I think should be straightened out but It will fit on the stock in the designated inlets.  The trigger guard is made out of cast iron I believe.  can it be heated with a heat gun or will it require a fire. I do have a wood stove that I can get some hot coals going in.

The instructions say to sand the milling marks off the barrel before finishing it.  I don't see any milling marks, but I assume I need to sand it anyway to prep it for the browning or bluing solution. I will be working on that tonight.   

thanks for the help and interest.
Kirby