long barrels

[rollingblock]

seen reference to 48 inch barrels and was wondering what school and makers would have used such long barrels

[James Wilson Everett]

Probably a lot of the early Pennsylvania gunmakers used long barrels.  In his book Thoughts on the Kentucky Rifle in its Golden Age, Joe Kindig illustrates an unsigned Lancaster County gun with a barrel length of 56 inches  (#14 in the book).  Actually, 48 inches barrel length was not too unusual.  Here is what a Lancaster County gun looks like with a 56 inch barrel.

Jim

[Mike Brooks]

48" is not unusual.

[Paul Griffith]

Then of course there's the occasional log gun shooter:

[Kermit]

My shortest barreled gun carries a 42", then there are two at 44", one at 48", and a chunk gun at 54". I have another 48" barrel waiting for me. Shorter than this seems strange to me, unless it's a jaeger or a percussion schuetzen.
 

[rollingblock]

those long barrel guns look really nice, have read stories about the pioneers loading on the run bet that would be a trick. can see were the longer sighting radius would be a benefit though. just thought that since most barrels you see are 42 inches this was kinda standard for the differant schools need to do more research.

[James Wilson Everett]

Rollingblock,

I agree with your comment to do more research.  Certainly all of us need to do this.  Just a thought on barrel lengths - quite a few of the original guns we have today have had their barrels shortened at some time. 

Jim

[pathfinder]

I just recived a gun with a 48" smoothbore barrel,I'll be shooting it next week,and I have to be honest it sure hold's nice. I'm 6'-1" and NOW 215lbs(down from 280,yes I'M BRAGGING! ),so maybe my stature might have something to do with it.


Ps 1Chunker,thats one fine shootin' iron ya got there! What's the particulars on that beauty?

[Kermit]

I think the stock blank must have been a repurposed barn beam. Gives a whole new slant on "barn gun."

[duca]

Lol, Ya right. Love those Long Barrels..

[James Wilson Everett]

Guys,

A true story about the long gun in the photo above.  I bought a nice long gunstock blank on E-Bay, long enough for a 56" barrel.  So, cut the wood back for a 42" barrel - no way!  I made the barrel to fit the wood!  Yes, backwards, I know - but at times I do strange things.

Jim

[PPatch]

Probably a lot of the early Pennsylvania gunmakers used long barrels.  In his book Thoughts on the Kentucky Rifle in its Golden Age, Joe Kindig illustrates an unsigned Lancaster County gun with a barrel length of 56 inches  (#14 in the book).  Actually, 48 inches barrel length was not too unusual.  Here is what a Lancater County gun looks like with a 56 inch barrel.

Jim

That rifle gives new meaning to the term "reach out and touch someone." Mine is 44" and holds steady as a rock, I think a 56 incher would tip me over. ;o)

dp

[Don Getz]

Chunker.........you're looking great, a mere child.   I miss seeing all of you guys, may have to make another trip to Pall Mall......................Don

[volatpluvia]

James,
Like buying a new jacket to suit your tie.
volatpluvia

[David R. Pennington]

Original barrels were forge welded. Today we had first session in our experiment with welding up a barrel. We started with wagon tire. We started with two 36" long sections and after welding 2 of these together and working down the skelp to width we ended up with about 44" in length. I'm sure it will grow more in length by the time its welded into a tube. I suppose an original smith would take what ever length barrel he ended up with. I feel like perhaps this is why there is such a variety in original barrel lengths.

[DaveP (UK)]

That would certainly be in keeping with the more frugal attitudes of times gone by!

I have read that the original idea behind longer barrels was to get as much velocity as possible from a modest charge of powder. A quick on line search reveals that folk interested in barrel lengths are still primarily looking for muzzle velocity...
I have been trying ti find out how long a BP barrel needs to be to in order to be accurate, that is, to get a round ball spinning properly. I do realise that in the real world weight, balance and coffee consumption matter too!
If anyone could point me in the right direction I'd appreciate it - I've had no luck so far.

[Lucky R A]

   A side note on long barrels is that on original rifles you often see the heel of the butt plate badly worn or completely worn through from reloading.  I suspect that the gun was often dragged behind the shooter as he pushed the ingredients of the next load down the barrel.   Whether trying to catch up to his next meal or keeping body and soul together, long barrels present a challenge.   Some buttplates had a iron insert dovetailed into place to add wear resistance at this area.     Ron     

[James Wilson Everett]

Guys,

This is really a great discussion!  Keep it up.

Dave,

I think that the longer barrel lengths (smoothbore) also influenced the small shot pattern.  A short barrel, like 30", would give an open pattern; a moderate barrel, like 45", would give a tighter pattern; and a very long barrel, like 60", would give a very tight pattern.  Today with those shotguns we load from the wrong end of the barrel - we use cylinder - modified - full.  I think that this is the reason for those really long barrels on waterfowl guns, like the punt guns and market guns.  Although, it would be interesting to determine how the 18th c guys were able to measure the differences in velocity.

Ron,

You have hit the proverbial nail on the head!  When I clean/load the 56" barrel gun the gun sits at about 45 degrees as I am only 5' 9" and the gun is 6' 0".  No resting the butt plate on your toes when you do this.  Eventually the butt plate heel will wear, but probably not in my lifetime!  At my local shooting range the ground at the firing line is gravel, so I lay an old sheet of cardboard box to rest the butt plate on.

All the best,
Jim

[smokinbuck]

James,
I made the mistake of buying a copy of "Flinlock Fowlers" a few years ago and decided I had to have a LOOONG barreled fowler. A friend had some black walnut blanks that had been cut in the late 1940's and another friend, and gun builder, was able to get a 72" barrel blank and the rest is history. The gun was done in 20 ga and has a flint lock, rebuilt for the proper proportion, and the overall gun is 7'4" long. Talent and imagination.
Mark

[Paul Griffith]

Chunker.........you're looking great, a mere child.   I miss seeing all of you guys, may have to make another trip to Pall Mall......................Don

Good grief Don, that picture's probably 20 years old. The guy you'd be lookin for at Pall Mall will look a bit more like a cross between Redd Foxx & Janet Reno. Always enjoyed your wisdom. Loved the joke where the old boy scratches his chin whiskers & says, "well, she will have tonight"

Pathfinder: I think that gun had a 1 1/4" X 63" X 45 cal oct barrel. Old Flint Warren had those barrels drilled at some deep hole drill shop in Detroit years ago. After he died I ended up with one & reamed, rifled & milled it octagon. It's in West Virginia these days.

Paul

[TMerkley]

Barrel length was also determined by the height of the customer.  Usually, (my understanding) the muzzle of the barrel was to be at about chin height for the customer who ordered it from the maker.  I am sure that parts availability and materials also played a factor as well. 

[Dphariss]

seen reference to 48 inch barrels and was wondering what school and makers would have used such long barrels

"4 ft" barrels were common at least by 1750 or so.
Now does this mean 4 ft exactly? Probably not exact but close.
Barrels over 44 I find to be to hard to load/clean not being as tall as James Arness.

Dan

[Bob Roller]

A rifle  with Boone provenence resides in our art museum here and
according to clothing that survives and documented as Boone's,Daniel
Boone was about 5'3" tall. This rifle is in FINE condition and I think
it is of European origin.The lock looks very much like the current L&R
Durs Egg. Anyhow,the barrel is 51"long,tapered and flared,45 caliber
and the gun handles just fine. The curator of the museum is 5'3" and she
wondered how it could be loaded someone her height and I told her the
rifle would have to be held at an angle to be loaded or going to farce,stand on the
tailgate of a truck.

Bob Roller

[axelp]

old Dan surely would have driven a pick up truck so the tailgate idea is likely.

[Hawken62_flint]

The market hunters used extra long barrels on their guns.  There is an original "punt gun" hanging inside Jungle Jim's Market, just outside Cincinnati, OH.  The barrel is over 9 feet long and the overall length of the gun is 10 1/2 feet.  It has 435 mother-of-pearl inlays.  Here are a couple of pictures--enjoy.