Author Topic: Latest pistol build  (Read 5559 times)

Offline Hawken62_flint

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Latest pistol build
« on: April 07, 2013, 07:53:06 PM »
Here are some pictures of my latest build, finished on Friday, and delivered to a buddy yesterday.  Learned a couple of things on this build.  1.  Hard to please someone when you are not exactly sure what they want. Built 1 pistol twice for this same fellow and he didn't like either rendition--I was trying to be too fancy for him.  I finally sold that pistol, but kept the barrel (put another barrel on the one I sold).  He finally said, no entry thimble, no carving, no sideplate, keep it plain, so this was the result.  2.  Don't put a date anywhere on the gun until you are absolutely certain that it is done.  This one has 2011 stamped on the barrel, along with my name, as I started this project 2 years ago--so.  3. ( I lied--I learned 3 things)  I, personally, am no longer building to order.  I will make guns in my own time and my own style, and if someone wants to buy it when it is done, then they are welcome. People are most of the time too hard to please, and since I am no Keith Casteel or Brian LaMaster, I will just do what I do and if it pleases me, then that is all I can ask.  Barrel is a GM .62 caliber smoothbore, turned octagon to round by a buddy of mine, trigger is handmade by my friend, Steve, lock is small Siler. Criticisms or questions are welcome.









Offline D. Taylor Sapergia

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Re: Latest pistol build
« Reply #1 on: April 07, 2013, 08:32:07 PM »
I'd love to hear what Allen, Mark, Hugh, Bill and Jim (among others) have to say, but since it appears I'm first here goes...

You are to be commended for your tenacity - dealing with clients can be ...interesting!  Your pistol shows that you have talent in inletting, and finishing.  But you need some direction in what constitutes an authentic and aesthetically pleasing pistol, if you decide to do another.  Your best bet is to buy some publications that have lots of images of pistols, failing to have a collection of originals at your disposal.  In studying these images, it is important to look for details and get dimensions of the pistols.  You have to know what it is supposed to look like before you can be expected to accomplish it.

Your pistol is chubby.  It is too deep from top of the barrel to the bottom of the forearm.  Your lock moldings are about three times as wide as would have been perfect.  Around 1/8" wide top and bottom looks best.  Install the pin that secures the forward end of the trigger guard through the lock mortise rather than through the molding...that will allow you to cut down the molding to its best dimension.

More than half of the ramrod should be exposed...yours seems buried in the stock.  Likewise, at least half of the barrel should be visible above the forearm, even a little more is fine.

File some draft on the finial of the trigger guard, and inlet it into the bottom of the forearm.

The web of wood between the rod hole and the barrel should be only thick enough to allow passage of the forward lock screw...1/8" or a little more.  Yours appears to be 5/16" or more.  That contributes to a very heavy forearm and consequently, a chubby pistol.

I hope you don't take offense to my observations - they are meant to be constructive and in no way mean spirited. 
D. Taylor Sapergia
www.sapergia.blogspot.com

Art is not an object.  It is the excitement inspired by the object.

Offline Hawken62_flint

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Re: Latest pistol build
« Reply #2 on: April 08, 2013, 05:08:06 PM »
Taylor,  thanks for your remarks.  I know that I have a long way to go in pistol and rifle building.  Have you ever been to the point where you take wood off and you take some more and you think you have it thinned down enough, and then, when you put on the stain and finish the wood seems to grow?  As for the trigger guard inlet, I did inlet it slightly, but could have gone deeper.  It is deep enough to shut out any light coming thru under it.  I also took the entry hole for the ramrod back more than an inch further than I had it originally, as it didn't look right, and so, I should have taken it back (opened it up) another inch or more to expose half the ramrod.  You are exactly correct in that it is too thick top to bottom.  And I really have trouble with the lock panels being too wide.  All your comments will be helpful as I have 2 pistols to build for myself and I will put your criticisms to good use.  Luckily, the person that I was building this for is not a person to compare it to originals and it didn't have to be PC for him.  He wanted a plain pistol to hunt with.  He loved it and after all the trials and tribulations in getting him something that he liked, I was pleased.  I did lose money on this deal, as I took $300 to buy parts and get started, but didn't have the heart to charge him more since he had waited 2 years for it.  Thanks again for stepping up and reviewing my build.

Offline Rolf

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Re: Latest pistol build
« Reply #3 on: April 08, 2013, 06:50:33 PM »
I'd recommend doing a few practice stocks, reusing the same parts.

I made 5 practce stocks before doing my first build. Each stock was discussed on this site and I learned alot from it. People here are very helpful with suggestions and guidance. I made practice stocks out of birch or box wood. I also dissected them on the bandsaw. I learned a lot about part placement that way.This was a big help when I made my first pair of pistols.


Best regards
Rolf
« Last Edit: April 08, 2013, 07:07:31 PM by Rolf »

Offline Pete G.

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Re: Latest pistol build
« Reply #4 on: April 09, 2013, 12:47:31 AM »
I have found that it is more difficult to build a pistol that looks right than a rifle. Perhaps there is not as much to look at so you notice things more.

You could always remove some more wood and refinish.

Offline D. Taylor Sapergia

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Re: Latest pistol build
« Reply #5 on: April 09, 2013, 02:54:39 AM »
Rolf, every rifle and pistol I build is a practice piece.  i hope some day to get it right.  We all do.
D. Taylor Sapergia
www.sapergia.blogspot.com

Art is not an object.  It is the excitement inspired by the object.

Offline Acer Saccharum

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Re: Latest pistol build
« Reply #6 on: April 09, 2013, 03:34:13 AM »
Taylor, truer words were never spoken(or typed).

T
Tom Curran's web site : http://monstermachineshop.net
Ramrod scrapers are all sold out.

Offline Hawken62_flint

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Re: Latest pistol build
« Reply #7 on: April 09, 2013, 03:00:23 PM »
Taylor, I went back and reread what you said about half the ramrod being exposed.  I didn't read it correctly the first time.  So, I guess the entry hole is positioned Ok, but I needed to expose more of the ramrod itself where it is exposed.  Top to bottom of the stock needs cut down, thereby, exposing more of the rod--thanks, I will remember on next build for sure.

Offline Don Getz

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Re: Latest pistol build
« Reply #8 on: April 09, 2013, 04:10:40 PM »
Taylor........I am working on another barn gun, using a pre-shaped stock as I always do.  Before I started to get into the
shaping around the lock, I drilled a few holes to find the ramrod hole.   This stock has a web that is over 1/4" thick.  When
this happens, it is near impossibel to get a neat, trim gun, unlike the fowler by Matt Harshbarger.   That is why that ramrod
hole is so important when it come to getting good architecture on a gun, and is so important when doing a barn gun since
that is the only thing you have going for you.  Oh well...........Don

Offline E.vonAschwege

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Re: Latest pistol build
« Reply #9 on: April 09, 2013, 06:31:38 PM »
You've already heard the big notes on your pistol and areas that need improvement, so I'll add one small detail that helped me a lot with the lock panels.  I notice on your pistol that the pin holding the triggerguard in place enters through the lock panel.  When inletting a triggerguard, keep in mind that the pin can (and often should) be hidden within the lock mortise.  This will help you gauge the thickness of wood below the lock, and will allow you to really slim down the lock panels without worrying about a pin.  As Don said - the lines are ultimately what carry a gun.  Build some more pistols and check in as you go - we'd love to see!  Best,
-Eric
Former Gunsmith, Colonial Williamsburg www.vonaschwegeflintlocks.com

Offline Rolf

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Re: Latest pistol build
« Reply #10 on: April 09, 2013, 07:02:31 PM »
Rolf, every rifle and pistol I build is a practice piece.  i hope some day to get it right.  We all do.

I hope no one thought I meant to implie my work is flawless.  I'm still a newbie with a lot to learn from you. But, doing practice stocks helped me avoid my worse mistakes on the finished pair of pistols, and it's a lot cheaper to learn by reusing the same parts.

Best regards
Rolf
« Last Edit: April 09, 2013, 07:26:22 PM by Rolf »

Offline KentSmith

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Re: Latest pistol build
« Reply #11 on: April 09, 2013, 07:58:43 PM »
Your barrel and breechplug tang inlet looks good.  Your lock inlet looks good tight and neat.  The triggerguard forward could be deeper but the rear looks good and that is a real tricky job on a pistol.  As mentioned above the web between the bottom of the barrel and the ramrod groove throws everything off because of its thickness.  At first sight I thought to suggest you rework the pistol by fixing the groove but I think you would uncover the ramrod hole forwrd of the trigger.  I had the same problem with a fowler I once made from a pre-carve stock.  The web was too thick and the whole gun was chubby.  I deepened the rrod channel removed the extra forearm wood, uncovered about 3 inches of the rrod hole in the upper forearm, covered that with a wear plate and in general slimmed down the gun so I felt better about it.  Salvaged the work, learned a great deal and made up a story about years of wear on a saddle, yada, yada, that made my interpretation fun.  And all the time I was in the shop working on a gun - what could I have spent all that time on that would have been more fun.

Nice thing about learning this hobby, if one try does not go right, most of the parts can be used in another attempt.  Unless you are committed to keeping it as is, I'd try to implement the above suggestions, knowing you will likely create new challenges, be patient, overcome the obstacles, have fun and show us what you end up with.