Frizzen & Pan- Slight gap

[Jon Williams]

How are you great builders of these fine historic rifles correcting gaps between pan and frizzen when closed?  Also noticed alittle of the touch hole from barell side when closed.

[keweenaw]

The lock plates on current cast locks aren't hard.  Stone the bottom of the pan cover to flat on a diamond plate or other stone, put on a very thin coat of a spotting compound - I use prussian blue but even soot will work and snap the frizzen closed.  Very carefully file the high spots from the edges of the pan using a small smooth file.  If the inside edge of the frizzen isn't almost against the barrel, the lock is either not set deeply enough or it's set in at an angle instead of being parallel with the side flat.  The bolster of the lock should contact the side of the flat, if it doesn't set the lock down until it does.  If it does contact the flat the the angle is probably off and you can probably get by by filing a touch off the bolster until frizzen just clears the barrel.

If you can see the touch hole above the pan cover when the frizzen is closed you have other major problems - see the other current thread on touch hole peep shows.

Tom

[Dphariss]

How are you great builders of these fine historic rifles correcting gaps between pan and frizzen when closed?  Also noticed alittle of the touch hole from barell side when closed.

Files and scrapers and soot or dyekem/magic marker to show the high spots.

Dan

[rich pierce]

For me, it's usually difficult to impossible to fix a gap at the hinge area by filing the pan because of the pivoting action.  File and fit till the frizzen heel is buried in the pan and the gap at the hinge remains.

[Don Getz]

I don't know what locks you are using but I have been using large siler locks I have gotten from Jim Chambers and I don't
even think about that frizzen to pan fit.   Years ago that used to be something we had to check.   I remember I came home
from Friendship with about a dozen "Ashmore" locks I picked up at Dixie for $15 apiece.   I don't think I ever used one on a
gun.  Some local guys bought them and built guns using them, they did have some of these problems.....you get what you
pay for........Don

[JDK]

.....you get what you
pay for........Don

I wish that were true neighbor.  Today the "big three" lock makers....and a few others....get about the same money for their locks.  As far as out of the box (or bag in this case) reliability and customer service, Chambers wins....hands down.  Enjoy, J.D.

[Eric Krewson]

Every time I encounter a problem with some component of one of my builds the answer pops in the next day or so.

Went turkey hunting with my new fowler yesterday, one tilt of the gun and my prime leaked out, never noticed this before as I was test shooting off a bench.

Chambers English round face lock, dye showed only about 10% contact frizzen to pan around the edge. I emailed Barbie to ask about it then found most of the problem.  The bottom of the frizzen looked smooth and solid, a closer look with my Optivisor revealed what looked like a crack. Picked at the crack and a tiny piece of casting slag or gray compressed sand fell off. Another dye check and my contact was up to about 75%, still needs some work but things look much better.

[Jim Kibler]

Sometimes pan to frizzen fit is good from production locks, somtimes not so good.  Just one of the things to check and fix if needed.  I guess this all depends on how picky one is as well.  In truth, I'm not sure it matters all that much.  As to fixing a gap that is near the pivot...  If it's small it can be closed up by just filing and allowing the frizzen to rotate further forward.  If it's fairly big, I've bent the pivot arm and toe of the frizzen upward a bit.  On a Chambers lock, these areas are usually soft and can be tweaked a little cold.  They can also be twisted to help with front to back alignment, rather than relying just on filing.

[wmrike]

First, I'm not the great builder you are referring to, but I am cautious.  I try to have a spare frizzen for each lock so that I don't get stuck waiting if somethings goes sideways.  Just buying individual parts, they are, like Tom said, soft.  After the spare frizzen is filed to shape, and mostly filed to fit the pan, I take strip of 220 wet and dry, wide enough to cover the pan, and close the new frizzen on it, rough side up.  After a couple of strips and maybe 15-20 passes over the pan and under the frizzen, the fit is pretty good.  Use lots of WD-40 to make certain the process is good and messy.  Some thumb pressure on the frizzen helps the things along.

[Gaeckle]

  If it's fairly big, I've bent the pivot arm and toe of the frizzen upward a bit.  On a Chambers lock, these areas are usually soft and can be tweaked a little cold.  They can also be twisted to help with front to back alignment, rather than relying just on filing.

..........I like this approach.........makes a lot of sense.........good info, thanks Jim......

[James Wilson Everett]

Guys,

When hand making a lock it is very easy, but this does not work with the cast store-bought ones.  Before hardening the frizzen you assemble the frizzen to the lock and use a smart hammer blow to final form the pan/frizzen mating surfaces.  With a faceted flash pan you put the bottom of the flash pan on the top surface of your anvil.  Then using a stout punch (this can be made from a scrap piece of hardwood) give the frizzen cover a good smack with a hammer.  In no time the pan to frizzen surface is nearly air tight.  Generally a couple of good smacks will do it.  With a lock with a rounded pan it is best to carve a hard wood "swage block" to hold the pan bottom.

Sometimes after hardening the frizzen the gap opens a tiny bit, but not enough to be of concern.

Jim