Next step in learning the ins and out of AF

[m. reaver]

So I finally got the AF to blush the right way.  I left the maple sit for 24 hours and then attempted to neutralize with baking soda and distilled water.  About half the color leeched into a cotton washcloth and the remaining stain appears as a very light reddish color.

I was under the impression that when brought to blush the AF stained maple would retain the colors better.

Where did I go wrong with neutralizing?

[Jerry V Lape]

So once it dried after the neutralizing have you applied some oil finish to it?  And what color is it now that it has some finish?  The neutralizing just takes off the stuff sitting on the surface in my experience.  The advantage of the AQ is the ions of iron get carried into the wood and they are retained.  You can also apply additional coats to get more ions absorbed.  But in my experience with the Wahkon Bay AQ I needed to cut back the surface stain as mine usually comes out way dark.  The maple on this knife was black after blush and I had to use 400 sandpaper to get it cut back to this color.

[snowdragon]

I'm in agreement with Jerry, neutralizing acts somewhat as a detergent, and when wiped off, can remove some surface color. This is only superficial residue however, not the color that has permanently absorbed into the wood. The rougher the surface of the wood, the more residue you will see on your wiping cloth, so I wonder if your samples were not sanded as smoothly as a finished stock would be.

And like Jerry mentioned, applying some finish over the neutralized aqua fortis will give you the true results. Try doing that, I'll bet you like what you see. I have a feeling you are just over thinking this process. good luck. Bill

[woodburner]

Scrapple,I hope the stain in that washcloth is a lot lighter than your stock.   Tim

[E.vonAschwege]

Funny story about neutralizing aquafortis...   My first experience with it was not on a rifle, but on a very intricate jewelry box I made for the girl I was dating at the time (I was 18).  Had all sorts of trap doors and secret areas - I was quite proud of it, and the aquafortis made the maple gorgeous.  It was finished with tru-oil if I recall correctly.  She was quite thrilled with the box, immediately put all of her jewelry inside, and broke up with me 2 weeks later.  About 3 months go by and I get a call asking if I have a spare key for it - sure enough I do, I drive over and open it up, to find that all of her silver jewelry is tarnished and her "gold" (plated) jewelry is flaking apart.  It was the next day that I realized I never neutralized the stain.  OOPS!!!!!   

It's definitely worth it to neutralize it for your hardware's sake, and to keep it from progressively getting darker with age.  Some folks tweak the color of the aquafortis with a diluted dye if you're not satisfied with the results.  I'll use a teaspoon of baking soda in a big mason jar of water - it doesn't take much.  Good luck!
-Eric

[Dphariss]

So I finally got the AF to blush the right way.  I left the maple sit for 24 hours and then attempted to neutralize with baking soda and distilled water.  About half the color leeched into a cotton washcloth and the remaining stain appears as a very light reddish color.

I was under the impression that when brought to blush the AF stained maple would retain the colors better.

Where did I go wrong with neutralizing?

Some color will come off when its neutralized but I do not rub the stock much at all in this process. The liquid does the work.
If you have some undissolved baking soda in the water and you rub it it will be an abrasive.
Also if you oil it with a NATURAL OIL based finish it will darken the stock though it will usually take a week or more for the color to mature and on maple the change is not as great as on Walnut.
 
Dan

[m. reaver]

After reading the replies I'm realizing I need to add some more background info.

After you guys got me pointed in the right direction with applying AF, I neutralized a scrap and it washed out slightly.  No issues as it came back to the desired tone when oil was applied.

I then went to a maple stock which was sanded down to 400 grit and whiskered between sandings.  After applying and warming the AF, the stock was a little darker than desired but I figured it would rub back a bit when neutralized.

Following neutralizing with baking soda and distilled water, the stock was left to dry and came out considerably lighter and uneven in places.  Particularly around sharp edges and more rounded areas (edge of lower butt, cheekpiece edge, wrist, lower forearm, etc.  Some of these areas show almost no color.

I initially assumed it was due to being too aggressive when removing the baking soda mixture (as Dan mentioned) or possibly my AF solution being too weak for this piece of maple.

Some observations; 1. Before neutralizing, I tried to apply a second treatment of AF as some mentioned they apply several coats.  The maple wouldn't absorb anymore AF, it appeared to only streak across the stock and not penetrate. 2. After it was neutralized and dried out, I noticed almost none of the grain was raised as I'd expected to see. 3. Following the neutralization of my test scraps, I found the penetration to be deep enough that the blush remained dark and even across the entire piece.

Is it okay to apply another, possibly stronger application of AF?  What's a good estimate of the time it takes for the solution to neutralize the acid?

Thanks for the help so far.

[Jim Kibler]

I wouldn't bother with neutralizing.  Many respected builders share this view.

[D. Taylor Sapergia]

I own two rifles that I finished with Ferric Nitrate, dissolving the crystals in water.  Neither of them, one of which has brass furniture, the other steel, shows any signs that the stain has oxidized the metal.

I did however, stain a leather 'slide', a slip on cartridge carrying device, with the same stuff.  It turned a wonderful even black.  But it has an affinity for the brass cartridge cases.  Even after neutralizing with baking soda and water, it continued to corrode the brass cases.

[oakridge]

If your AF solution is super-saturated with iron there would be no need to neutralize. Some of the off-the-shelf solutions may still be very acidic and need neutralizing. Just my take. Tell me if I'm wrong.

[sweed]

D. Taylor

That could be left over Tanic acid in the leather itself, from the tanning process, and have nothing to do with the stain. Some saddles will eat conchas, if allowed to get wet.