Teflon Patching

[moleeyes36]

A snowbird shooter from Ohio that shoots with us in our local Florida club during the winter told us that when he was at last fall's NMLRA National Championship Shoot in Friendship he heard that they were going to ban use of Teflon patching on the range.  It was supposedly because of the EPA's phasing out the use of Teflon for environmental reasons.  I don't know if that is true or just another wild rumor.  Has anybody heard anything on the subject?

[Charlie B]

Currently on board and serving as treasurer, have never heard of this in theory or in fact!

[moleeyes36]

Thanks.  I just signed on as a Field Rep and couldn't find it listed in the rule book I received either.  But I thought it might be something that came along since the rule book was last updated.  I know the EPA is in the process of banning Teflon in most applications, including cookware, so I though it could be true. 

[rtadams]

5-20-13

Moleeyes36,

If Teflon tape is banned by the EPA, the plumbers/pipefitters will be going back to the reliable "Rectorseal 5" slow-dry pipe sealeant or equivalent. What's next?

Best Regards,

Robert

[Jerry V Lape]

EPA has a plan to ban humans based on intermittent H2S gaseous emissions probably!

[LH]

EPA has a plan to ban humans based on intermittent H2S gaseous emissions probably!

You got that right! 

[wet willy]

A ban on Teflon-coated patches has been around, in my memory, for about 20 years. I've no idea why some would ban them, but I would speculate because Teflon is a 20th century product and not consistent with 18th century firearms.

PTFE, a chemical used in making Teflon, is thought to be harmful when ingested, as in Teflon-coated cookware.  Looks like it is/will be banned soon by the EPA.

[Bob Roller]

Teflon patches to me are like Smith&Wesson sights on a percussion revolver,
or aluminum butt plates and trigger guards and ersatz powders. No real need
for any of it.

Bob Roller

[Bob Roller]

They will NOT ban H2S gaseous emissions. It will be taxed.

Bob Roller

[moleeyes36]

I never tried Teflon patching and don't plan to.  Though I don't see any reason for anybody not to use them if you want, I'm just too set in my old fashioned flintlock ways.  I feel like I'm going high tech when I shoot one of my percussion guns.

But if the government taxes H2S gaseous emissions like Bob Roller suspects, they could erase the national debit just from taxing the cloud that seems to constantly hang all over Washington, DC.

[Dphariss]

A ban on Teflon-coated patches has been around, in my memory, for about 20 years. I've no idea why some would ban them, but I would speculate because Teflon is a 20th century product and not consistent with 18th century firearms.

PTFE, a chemical used in making Teflon, is thought to be harmful when ingested, as in Teflon-coated cookware.  Looks like it is/will be banned soon by the EPA.

They ban things like this because someone shows up who uses it and out shoots everyone.  Trust me.
For example underhammer rifles are banned, I am told on excellent authority, from state level  ML shoots in Wyoming. Apparently some one shot too good with one at some point. Its certainly not because they are not HC...
Used right teflon will REALLY shoot, I am told by a barrel maker.

Dan

[LH]

Whats the "right" way to use it?  When I tried it on a couple of occasions,  I didn't get any better accuracy than with my liquid lube.  Used up a lot more cleaning patches though.   

[smylee grouch]

I have used alot of teflon patching from three different sources in barrels by four different makers ( Green Mtn, De Hass, Rice,  Carpenter) and all shot fantastic. Yes, they used an extra cleaning patch between shots.

[Dphariss]

Whats the "right" way to use it?  When I tried it on a couple of occasions,  I didn't get any better accuracy than with my liquid lube.  Used up a lot more cleaning patches though.   

When you change something like patch lube, from tallow or oil to a dryer patch for example, load development starts over.
Slick lubes may need more powder than "dry lubes".
Many people do not shoot enough powder.
People will wipe the bore but do so inconsistently.
If wiping between shots is done its got be be the SAME every time same amount of wetness, same number of strokes with the wet and dry patches. I use a "wet patch" bot sides then a dry patch both sides. Soft nap flannel. Patches uniformly wet but far from dripping.
The lands have to be wiped clean. Or the patch lube has to clean them.  If the liquid lube is water based it will likely do this. But if the barrel does not shoot well with a slick bore this may not work well. Or it may require more powder than a high friction lube does.

Dan

[mbush50]

Telfon Patching is not magic patching, but used properly it is very good for bench shooting. In my opinion, one should not use an oil based "moose milk" to clean between shots. I have used 1 oz of Dawn, 15oz of alcohol, to 1 gal of water for years with better than average results. Other things to look at when using Teflon is the material itself, if the material is loose weave spraying Teflon on it won't help. The old Sansouce (sorry I misspelled his name), was very good, Texas 0.20 is outstanding. I have heard it is not available anymore, which is to bad. I believe that when the Telfon is on top of the powder for a long period of time (while waiting of a wind change) the powder does not change, because it in not wet or oily.
A couple of more things to remember, when using oversized balls and Teflon the crown can not have any sharp edges and don't use a short started that is to big. If one tears the patching while loading it will still come apart Teflon or not.
Michael

[smylee grouch]

Michael, I think his first name was Francis, but what ever it was he made a good product and I shot with him and Jim Goodioen more than once. Texas patching was also good but my buddy Marvin from Witcita Falls wasnt at the WNS this year so I couldnt stock up on the patching that he usualy sold. You are right in that like any product, you have to use it right to get the best results. I like the stuff for bench and cross stix matches but use tightly woven cotton with olive oil and bear lard for hunting. Lots of different combos to try.

[Lutes]

Michael I do not use moose milk for cleaning but do use it for patch lube. (Wet) What is your reasons for not using it for a cleaner between shots?  Just curious?

[mbush50]

I bought some of the Texas stuff from Tip Curtis, but it was expensive.

Michael

[mbush50]

Hi Lutes,
We were told that the oil did not mix well with Teflon, there was a reaction to it and always shot Teflon dry. Don't know if it is true, but I have always used the Dawn mixture when shooting Teflon and a moose milk when not. I shot next to a kid at WNS in March and he used water on his Teflon and had great results, he was 2nd in the Bench Agg, I was 3rd. Probally should have paid more attention to him!  Nothing wrong with moose milk. What do you use for cleaning?
Michael

[Lutes]

An old mixture of alcohol , peroxide and Murphy's oil soap. Do you shoot the Teflon dry? I know some do and some don't. I don't. Tried dry but just didn't group as good for me. Been shooting ml for a long time but still learning everyday. I am just now trying to get into bench shooting. Got a lot to learn.

[Dogshirt]

Hi Lutes,
We were told that the oil did not mix well with Teflon, there was a reaction to it and always shot Teflon dry. Don't know if it is true, but I have always used the Dawn mixture when shooting Teflon and a moose milk when not. I shot next to a kid at WNS in March and he used water on his Teflon and had great results, he was 2nd in the Bench Agg, I was 3rd. Probally should have paid more attention to him!  Nothing wrong with moose milk. What do you use for cleaning?
Michael

I've seen this for years in small bore competition. If I smear cow $#1T on my rifle and shoot 10 over my average, next week 10 guys will have cow $#1t smeared on their rifles. Just do what works for you and don't pay ANY attention to what the guy next to you is doing. He's PROBABLY just a better shot than you!

[Lutes]

Yea I have seen the same thing happen on type of guns, powder patching you name it.lol

[mbush50]

I once talked to a guy who had a bottle of baby powder he sprinkled  on his sand bag just before he put his rifle down, I ask why? His answer was his friend did it. My experience is only those that don't win chase the rainbow for the 'magic gun, patch lube...." and those to lazy to work at it!
Michael

[dagner]

  one of the old urban legends you hear every year about outlawing teflon patch.go up and down the benchline -chunk line or offhand line.welcome to teflon by almost all competative  shooters  and  shot records,  when you are after the smallest group possible .some shoot it dry or wipe with a damp patch before loading .some use a elmers glue bottle and put on drop  water beneath the ball to load easier. yes it is expensive .about 25 a yard.does it make any differnce to your roundivious - re-enactor shooting or average shooter  -no.bottom line just like the arguement between swiis and goex.you dont like it. dont want to pay for it .then dont use it.

[Dphariss]

I once talked to a guy who had a bottle of baby powder he sprinkled  on his sand bag just before he put his rifle down, I ask why? His answer was his friend did it. My experience is only those that don't win chase the rainbow for the 'magic gun, patch lube...." and those to lazy to work at it!
Michael

There are a lot of things people do that may not work for the next shooter.
If the rifle shot better if it slid easily on the bag rather than grabbing it who is to say baby powder is not a good idea?
Most would never know the difference anyway. But some people are more serious and methodical than others.
So while doing because his buddy did is not a valid reason (who may have did it for psychological reasons for all I know) but testing it could not hurt.

Dan